D&D 5E Distance Estimation

[overgeeked]

You are saying that a wizard/archer/character would know if something was in range of their abilities or not. I think we all agree on that. But then you are saying that they wouldn't know the exact measurement. Where we seem to disagree is on the implications of this. You say that if the player misjudges the distance, then the character fails. Myself (and others?) are saying, no, the character does not fail because they character would know if they are in range or not.

The difference is in the precision of information. The character would only roughly know range bands, not precise distances. That ambiguity is important to me as it brings in some verisimilitude. The character may think they’re at the edge of short range, but are actually in medium range; they may think they’re at the edge of medium, but are in long range; they may think they’re at the edge of long range but actually be just out of range. That’s a real thing that happens to people because they don’t know exactly how distant something is, they can only roughly guess.

It's a lot like puzzles, do you solve them with player ability or character abilities? I prefer RPG challenges to be based around character abilities, not player abilities. You seem to enjoy the other method. Neither is wrong.

Characters don’t know precise distances, that’s the point.

 

[LordEntrails]

Your take is interesting, but not how I chose to play.

 

[overgeeked]

Your take is interesting, but not how I chose to play.

Likewise, I'm sure.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

That ambiguity is important to me as it brings in some verisimilitude.

Appeal to V-tude is a cancer that needs to be cut out of gaming discourse. D&D sucks donkey butt at being realistic. Do you think it's realistic that people stand perfectly still in combat, waiting their turn to act, and afterwards remain perfectly still until it is there time to go again? Because that is what the rules reflect, but that isn't remotely how a fight works in real life. People are moving at the same time, back and forth. They aren't standing in a 5 foot square.

The rules are abstractions there to facilitate gameplay.

 

[Oofta]

Appeal to V-tude is a cancer that needs to be cut out of gaming discourse. D&D sucks donkey butt at being realistic. Do you think it's realistic that people stand perfectly still in combat, waiting their turn to act, and afterwards remain perfectly still until it is there time to go again? Because that is what the rules reflect, but that isn't remotely how a fight works in real life. People are moving at the same time, back and forth. They aren't standing in a 5 foot square.

The rules are abstractions there to facilitate gameplay.

You don't get to decide for everyone else what matters to them. I will be the first to admit that D&D isn't particularly realistic but neither is it completely abstract. I liken it to action movie logic with magic. So yes, I want a sense of being there, of it making sense given the constructs and assumptions of the world our PCs inhabit.

You may not consider verisimilitude important, I do. I want the game to feel real to the genre in which we play.

 

[plisnithus8]

I started having players make their own estimations when I had set up without a grid for a large space. Players would ask me as the DM if something was in range or if the could dash to get within melee range. Instead of measuring all the time I started just reminding them that 6” on the table was 30’ so a normal dash was a ruler’s length. They got used to it quickly. think I got the idea from Matt on Critical Role telling players in a similar situation “You can certainly try.”
I don’t always play gridless; when on a grid or TotM, estimation isn’t a thing.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

You don't get to decide for everyone else what matters to them. I will be the first to admit that D&D isn't particularly realistic but neither is it completely abstract. I liken it to action movie logic with magic. So yes, I want a sense of being there, of it making sense given the constructs and assumptions of the world our PCs inhabit.

You may not consider verisimilitude important, I do. I want the game to feel real to the genre in which we play.

The genre we play is heroic fantasy. Making someone miss because of 2 feet of range because they chose to obfuscate it as a gotcha isn't v-tude affirming but petty. Moreover, unless you're rolling for the monsters to see if they're out of range, it's just more "v-tude for thee, not for me". The term is just a buzzword to try and give someone's tastes an air of legitimacy.