D&D (2024) Jeremy Crawford: “We are releasing new editions of the books”

[Umbran]

and I assure you that you are miss understanding what we are telling you.

Maybe. Maybe not. Probably I do. And I don't buy it sorry.

Mod Note:
Folks, you aren't going to get past this in a "Yes I do!" "No you don't!" mode of exchanges. It is either time to engage in some more constructive manner, or leave it be, please and thanks.

 

[TwoSix]

Are you saying that because party mix and encounter mix vary so wildly, that there can be no guidelines?

I'm not @Maxperson, but I would say numerical guidance is generally a waste of time. You can have general categories around Early Levels/Mid Levels/Late Levels, and mook/standard/boss/big boss, but that's about it.

 

[Maxperson]

Are you saying that because party mix and encounter mix vary so wildly, that there can be no guidelines?

Not accurate ones. It gets even worse when you factor in player skill which varies wildly. It's far better to teach DMs how to assess their players and characters vs. monsters and let the DM do the match-ups. I ditched CR for 3e, 3.5 and 5e and just do my own assessments, but then I've had decades of practice. New DMs need advice in the DMG for it.

For GMs of LevelUp or other 5E clones... do those rules get CR right for encounter design?

I don't think CR can ever get it right. It can only be applied uniformly across too many variables for it to ever be accurate. You can have CR systems that are better or worse than 5e, but not one that works well. At least not in my opinion.

 

[Faolyn]

I'm not @Maxperson, but I would say numerical guidance is generally a waste of time. You can have general categories around Early Levels/Mid Levels/Late Levels, and mook/standard/boss/big boss, but that's about it.

This is how I would do it. The game is already split into tiers of play. Just refine those a bit better and then base monster power off of that. Maybe even create more powerful versions for the next tier or three as well.

 

[OldSchoolGamerGirl]

I don't think CR can ever get it right. It can only be applied uniformly across too many variables for it to ever be accurate. You can have CR systems that are better or worse than 5e, but not one that works well. At least not in my opinion.

I think the idea of CR sounds great, but in pratice I think there has to be more 'give' to the system.

 

[mamba]

I think the idea of CR sounds great, but in pratice I think there has to be more 'give' to the system.

I think it needs the opposite for CR to work. Much less variability of power between classes of a given level. Maybe more power gain per level (which is reflected in CR 1 to CR 2, etc. becoming bigger jumps in monster power)

Of course this means 5 orcs are no longer the same CR as one troll (did not check….) and monsters fit into a narrow char level range a lot more than they do now.
Not sure this is better / wanted, but it is the only way to get a halfway accurate encounter math

 

[Pedantic]

We're already going so digital, I'd love to see some kind of CResque tool that can take party composition/state as an input, instead of a vaguely theorized "X-level generic party." Let's get detailed, and figure out how much harder the encounter will be if the druid is going in without wildshape.

 

[Maxperson]

I think it needs the opposite for CR to work. Much less variability of power between classes of a given level. Maybe more power gain per level (which is reflected in CR 1 to CR 2, etc. becoming bigger jumps in monster power)

I think you're correct in saying that there needs to be less variability for CR to work better. The problem I see with that is that it is really hard to give unique, fun abilities to classes and accomplish that goal. I think that the cure would likely be less fun than the illness.

 

[zedturtle]

We're already going so digital, I'd love to see some kind of CResque tool that can take party composition/state as an input, instead of a vaguely theorized "X-level generic party." Let's get detailed, and figure out how much harder the encounter will be if the druid is going in without wildshape.

That sounds like something DnD Beyond could easily (probably not, but it should be possible) do. It has all the variables, and just needs to crunch the numbers. It can't account for the 14-year-old at the table, saying 'I would like to Rage!' while charging the Ancient Red Dragon, or their 12-year old sibling who is being very careful with their tactics. But it should be able to account for the fact that the 12-year old's PC is optimised to the last hit point, and the 14-year-old is a mish-mash of 'that sounds cool!' (or vice-versa).

 

[Micah Sweet]

I mean.... that describes SO MUCH of 4e...

Only if you're a fan. The reality is not entirely untrue, but it is more nuanced than you're suggesting.