D&D (2024) People on this forum are creating confusion. Not WotC.

[Charlaquin]

I know there are things they can do that would change MY mind. I can’t talk for others.

Sure, there will always be variations between individual opinions. My point is more about the broad sentiment that the 2024 rules are a new edition. That sentiment isn’t going away, regardless of what WotC says. If they’re making new core rulebooks, they’re making a new edition in the minds of many.

 

[Morrus]

I can even understand that discussions and the rejections. But going by your ENworld numbers 50% think it is not. So saying that WotC lies about that topic seems wrong.

Last time I checked, you can have different opinions without calling the other one a liar.

Calling other members liars is a civility issue you should report and let the mods deal with it. Disagreeing with WotC's position on the matter is valid for this forum.

It sound like your issue is with civility rather than the actual opinions held. As I said, if people are calling each other liars, or being otherwise uncivil, please report it.

 

[Justice and Rule]

I don’t think there’s anything WotC can do that will change people’s minds about this. It’s not a matter of people being confused, it’s a matter of people believing that changing the contents of the core rulebooks beyond simple errata necessarily constitutes a change of rules edition. Maybe an edition with very similar rules to the previous edition; maybe even an edition that’s backwards-compatible with the previous edition. But no matter how many times or in what ways WotC reassures people that the 2024 rules are the same edition of D&D as the 2014 rules, a significant portion of the audience firmly believes that change of rules = change of edition.

Part of that probably stems from the start of the playtest where they were doing more interesting, stronger changes than they seem to be doing now. Like, some of the stuff there did feel more drastic compared to what it feels like we are going to get, and that sort of feeling probably carries through a lot of that.

But I also think that there are a lot of people coming from outside RPGs who have experience with updates and revisions (like people coming in from Games Workshop games) and read big rules updates as being new editions. A lot of people have experience outside of games and read the changes as a new edition and it's going to be hard to refute their own experience.

Really it'd just be better to lean into it and to focus on telling people that things like adventures won't be invalidated, given that Wizards puts out way more of those than anything else.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Calling other members liars is a civility issue you should report and let the mods deal with it. Disagreeing with WotC's position on the matter is valid for this forum.

It sound like your issue is with civility rather than the actual opinions held. As I said, if people are calling each other liars, or being otherwise uncivil, please report it.

Maybe you are right. Maybe I sometimes need to take a deep breath before I respond myself. I have to translate from German and sometimes in a haste, words seem more harsh then intended. And more direct than good for the discussion. And maybe not as clear as I think at times.

 

[Morrus]

I don’t think there’s anything WotC can do that will change people’s minds about this. It’s not a matter of people being confused, it’s a matter of people believing that changing the contents of the core rulebooks beyond simple errata necessarily constitutes a change of rules edition.

Yep, it's about the very definition of a game edition, which isn't necessarily something a company and its customers might agree on, labels notwithstanding. In fact, we even did a podcast episode about that very topic-- what is a new edition? It's not necessarily something one person, or indeed one company, can define.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Yep, it's about the very definition of a game edition, which isn't necessarily something a company and its customers might agree on, labels notwithstanding. In fact, we even did a podcast episode about that very topic-- what is a new edition? It's not necessarily something one person, or indeed one company, can define.

And still, WotC can state their opinion and their intent (not invalidating old content) without being liars.

And now they are reversing innovations that I really liked because of the constant claims of stealth edition change and I hate that.

 

[Alzrius]

This forum is usually belligerently and unashamedly anti-WoC.

Notwithstanding things like the recent OGL debacle, what you're saying here does not match with my lived experience using these forums.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Notwithstanding things like the recent OGL debacle, what you're saying here does not match with my lived experience using these forums.

I think, that it is about 50-50 here for the last couple of month.

 

[Morrus]

And still, WotC can state their opinion and their intent (not invalidating old content) without being liars.

I repeat, if you see people being uncivil, please report it. WotC probably doesn’t need you to defend them though. They’re a big company!

And now they are reversing innovations that I really liked because of the constant claims of stealth edition change and I hate that.

I mean, I’m not sure how to respond to that. People are voicing their opinions on playtest material. Some of those opinions differ to yours. Those opinions are equally valid.

I also suspect you overestimate the effect that posters here have on the playtest process. The main source of data is the massive surveys they put out which gather volumes of data orders of magnitude larger than 1, 10 or even 100 posters here can generate.

 

[Alzrius]

I think, that it is about 50-50 here for the last couple of month.

Well, WotC has shot themselves in the foot several times in the last couple of months, so that's not surprising.