D&D (2024) Playtest Packet 6: They knocked Druid out of the Park

Level 6: Your attacks can deal radiant damage and as a bonus action you can gain resistance to slashing, piercing, and bludgeoning damage until the start of your next turn. You can use this ability as many times as your proficiency bonus, resetting on a long rest.
Already exsist as wild resurgence. Effectively...

As a bonus action, you can expend a spell slot to gain temporary hit points equal to 3 times your druid level. You gain an additional use after a short rest.

And you can Cure Wounds and Heal yourself. And can easily grab Shield spell with a feat (absorb elements seems to be missing?).
Level 10: While wildshaped, you can add your wisdom modifier to your melee attack damage rolls.
d8 bonus damage already exists in the base class.
Level 14: While wildshaped, you can add half your proficiency modifier to your melee attack rolls to hit.
I am a bit worried about the to-hit (and DC's).

Especially if I'm wanting to be a spider at high level.
 
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Exactly. But now worse, because you don't get anything like that massive potential hit point pool to let you soak a ton of damage even if you didn't contribute much offence. Current moon druids are amazing at low levels, decline quickly through middle levels, become great when they are buoyed up by elemental shapes at level 9, and slowly lose potency until they get almost infinitely durable with unlimited wild shapes at 20. This is obviously not great design, but at least they are never terrible (the problem is that they are sometimes too good).

This version of druid solves the latter problem - they are not ever going to be too good. The problem is that they go from good at levels 2-4, to absolutely terrible by higher levels. It's just a long, slow decline as you level up. And keep in mind that over 60% of druids are moon druids. So this is going to affect a lot of players.

They are also significantly more MAD than other druids, because they are supposed to be tanky, but this revised version uses their regular AC and doesn't give them nearly as many hit points as the current iteration. So they are incentivize to get their AC as high as possible, which with medium armour means a dex of 14, and also to maximize their constitution, on top of their wisdom. Though I suppose one way around this would be to play as a tortle druid, so you could just focus on wis and con.

The fantasy of the Moon Druid is of transforming into a beast and tearing into your opponent (basically, the D&D movie, if owl bears were allowed), but this version is not that, beyond low levels. Instead, this version is transforming into a beast that is increasingly a mild annoyance, at best, to your opponent. And has moonbeam.

I think they should do the following:

1. Let moon druids round up for the CR rating of their beast, not down (this is a small buff but will let them scale a little better).

2. Pick six iconic beasts and have a CR 1-7 version of each at the back of the new PHB (this won't take that much space, just extra stat blocks on top of the base description. This will ensure that the moon druid will always have some interesting options, not just "mammoth."

3. Forget moonbeam. I mean, sure, put it on their spell list and let them use while wildshaped, but that's it. Instead, use the Level 6, 10, and 14 slots to buff wildshape further, so that it stays competitive as the moon druid levels up.

Example:
Level 6: Your attacks can deal radiant damage and as a bonus action you can gain resistance to slashing, piercing, and bludgeoning damage until the start of your next turn. You can use this ability as many times as your proficiency bonus, resetting on a long rest.

Level 10: While wildshaped, you can add your wisdom modifier to your melee attack damage rolls.

Level 14: While wildshaped, you can add half your proficiency modifier to your melee attack rolls to hit.

Those are just spitballing - I haven't worked out any math - but the idea is to let the wildshaped form stay viable in combat as the druid levels up. Because let's face it, a mammoth (one attack, +10 to hit, 4d8+7 damage) is not exactly striking fear into anyone's heart at level 18.

I'm personally not too worried about the Moon Druid damage, because you are forgetting that they get +2d8 damage from the base class. So that mammoth is hitting for 6d8+7 which... yeah, even at level 18 that would make someone sit up and take notice. That's 34 damage on average. And even weaker beasts are going to be doing decent damage with that.

The bigger problem is accuracy. And I think calculating the Wildshape forms attacks and damage using Wisdom makes sense. You get your proficiency too, so the mammoth is rolling at a +12, which is real good. But when you look to the wolf, they would be a +7 using the proficiency, and I'd rather see that as a +9 or 10 by those levels.

hmmm.... 2d4+2d8+2 = 16 damage... that's a bit wimpy. But you'd be a dire wolf and 2d6+2d8+3 = 19 isn't bad. Firebolt is likely doing 3d10 = 16.5, maybe adding the int bonus. The damage might be a little lower than we'd like, but it isn't terrible for a full-caster.

That and the wild shape temp hp... Yeah, I think if we really wanted to make the damage great, all we'd need to do is make the druid add their wis mod to damage, and be able to use their wis spell attack to hit, but the proficiency swap and the extra damage dice are doing a good bit of work.
 

I just don't think it makes sense to have 40+ statblocks in the PHB.
it also doesn’t make sense to add 40+ statblocks to the MM, so one Druid subclass can use them

Functionally it belongs in the PHB, and if it is a waste of space in either, then either cut the number of statblocks down, or go with templates. I’d do the latter
 

Just to toss out a few ideas...

Lunar Regenerative
Instead of taking damage from your moonbeam, you regain half the hit points.
This has no effect on other moonbeams besides your own.

Lunar Rampage. (Combines with lunar regenerative)
When under a full moon. The concentration of your moonbeam can not be broken by damage or by becoming incapacitated (including at 0 HP). You can't use this again until the next full moon.

Lunar Hunt
When you attack a creature in your moonbeams. You gain advantage.
 
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hmmm.... 2d4+2d8+2 = 16 damage... that's a bit wimpy. But you'd be a dire wolf and 2d6+2d8+3 = 19 isn't bad. Firebolt is likely doing 3d10 = 16.5, maybe adding the int bonus. The damage might be a little lower than we'd like, but it isn't terrible for a full-caster.
+5d10 moonbeam

Not going to argue against anyone who want to kill with their claws instead of spells. Certainly a valid option.
But free movable moonbeam is a lot of extra damage.
 

+5d10 moonbeam

Not going to argue against anyone who want to kill with their claws instead of spells. Certainly a valid option.
But free movable moonbeam is a lot of extra damage.
I just don't think that's the fantasy of the Moon Druid. I think the fantasy of the Moon Druid is exactly what we see in the D&D movie - turning into a big freaking beast and tearing it up.

What about:

Level 6: Can do radiant damage while wildshaped.

Add griffon, owlbear, and shellshark to the wildshape list.

Level 10: Add evasion while wild shaped.

Add guardian wolf, manticore, and phase spider to the wildshape list.

Level 14: While wildshaped can make attacks using spell attack modifier, and add wisdom bonus to damage.

Add bullette, catoblepas, and sea lion to wildshape list.
 

Add griffon, owlbear, and shellshark to the wildshape list. Add guardian wolf, manticore, and phase spider to the wildshape list.
I would not object to having some monstrosities added to wild shape options. Especially since those really are just higher level bear / wolf / spider.

Werewolf seems like an obvious add as well.
Level 10: Add evasion while wild shaped.
Evasion on a Bear doesn't work IMO.


10: you can expend a spell slot to wild shape into a monstrosity. The CR you can turn into is equal to half the spell slot level. (Possibly chose from a list. Your DM may allow other forms).

14: if you wild shape into a CR 1/2 or lower creature. You do not expend wild shape or gain temporary hit points.
 
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I would not object to having some monstrosities added to wild shape options. Especially since those really are just higher level bear / wolf / spider.

Werewolf seems like an obvious add as well.

Evasion on a Bear doesn't work IMO.


10: you can expend a spell slot to wild shape into a monstrosity. The CR you can turn into is equal to half the spell slot level. (Possibly chose from a list. Your DM may allow other forms).

14: if you wild shape into a CR 1/2 or lower creature. You do not expend wild shape or gain temporary hit points.
I get the connection between Lycanthropes and Circle of the Moon, but to me that is its own thing. I think the idea of the Moon Druid is that you are shapeshifting into beasts, so I tried to stick to beast-like monstrosities (recognizing that manticore is marginal in that sense).

I wasn't totally sold on evasion either but was too lazy to come up with something more thematic. Maybe this is the level where you get to add your wisdom modifier to damage rolls while wildshaped, so that the damage scales a bit.

I really like Chaosmancer's suggestion of letting the Moon Druid use its spell attack modifier for melee attacks while wildshaped, or their to hit rolls just don't scale well enough at high levels. For example, a CR 5 Sea Lion only has a +6 to hit modifier, which would be about half that of a typical high level melee, or less depending on magic items.

Changing spell slots for beasts or monstrosities is a cool alternative idea, but I would do it same as polymorph (otherwise...why not just polymorph?), and definitely stick to a curated list as a lot of monstrosities are unique beings, highly intelligent, etc. (i.e. not really in line with the beast motif).

I love the last suggestion but I would make it baseline for Moon Druids (i.e. level 3) and change it to CR 1/4 or lower.
 


it also doesn’t make sense to add 40+ statblocks to the MM, so one Druid subclass can use them

Functionally it belongs in the PHB, and if it is a waste of space in either, then either cut the number of statblocks down, or go with templates. I’d do the latter

Druids aren't the only people who use Beasts. Dungeon Masters use them as well. Rarely have I found a time that a combat capable beast was "useless" to me.

And yes, Templates would be best, but we likely aren't getting them.
 

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