D&D General 5.5 and making the game easier for players and harder for DMs

[Chaosmancer]

So... this thread is just another "modern DnD is too easy and no one likes consequences" thread? I was hoping to see if there were actual problems with DMing in the new rules that I forgot, not just the idea that PC power is a problem.

I've been on record many, many times saying that I am a "no-death" DM. It is a huge annoyance to me when PCs die, and so I try to avoid it whenever possible. But, I have a dirty little secret I rarely bring up on these forums. If I DID have death in my games? Then I'd likely TPK the party at least once an adventure, and I'd definitely (if I was setting out with the goal of killing player characters) have a hefty number of dead PCs. There have been multiple campaigns, and multiple characters where I have been sweating bullets, because a particularly hot or cold run of the dice has left me in a situation where I myself am not sure if the PCs can win the day. Where they barely scrape by because of a lucky crit, or a particularly clever tactic.

Now, I have also had many , many people online tell me that I am a terrible DM, that I don't know what I am doing, that I am not running DnD properly, ect. So, if I, a terrible no-skill DM who cares too much about story have nearly TPK'd multiple parties by accident... what's your excuse for not being able to challenge them?

Bonus Action potions? We've been using Bonus Action potions for years, heck WOTC acknowledged how many tables use bonus action potions. I know someone mentioned that they prefered it to be an action because it caused decisions, but we've long found the opposite. Whenever we have had action potions, they almost never get used. I actually was annoyed once to get a potion of Hill Giant Strength as treasure, not because my paladin couldn't use it, but because there was never a point where "wait, let me get a +2 to my attacks" was a good tactical decision, and since the potion didn't last very long, then I couldn't take it before the fight. The only time potions got used was after a fight (healing potions), during a fight if we need to force feed someone a healing potion so they didn't die, or before a fight if we could stand around and prep buffs. Which was incredibly rare. Personally? I love bonus action potions because that means I might see people actually use potions I give out as treasure.

But, I'm not going to leave people with no advice either, and there is one thing that a lot of DMs I've talked to have forgotten or just don't use. Remember, the hp on the monster statblock? That is the average hp. Without changing the CR, you can boost that HP up to the max, or below. Also, if you don't mind changing the CR... change the monster's equipment. It is a minor change that isn't too much work for the DM if they are like me and write down stats ahead of time so they aren't flipping through the book. Take an Ogre that has 11 AC with hide armor and a greatclub dealing 2d8+4, and swap it for some chainmail giving them an AC of 16 and a Greataxe that does 2d12+4. That is a major bump in the monster's strength with minimal homebrewing.

Honestly, I know people decry homebrewing monsters as a sign that WoTC has sinned and created more work for the poor DM... but frankly, once you get to high enough player levels... homebrewing is just a necessity. Not because WoTC is horrible and bad and evil, but because groups diverge from the mean. You can't challenge a party of paladins and clerics who have magical gear that boosts their defenses and healing, and feats that allow them to buff and empower their allies with the same monster than can challenge team nova strike whose characters have all built to deal as much damage as possible on round 1. There is just never going to be a one-size fits all for high level play.

 

[DarkCrisis]

So... this thread is just another "modern DnD is too easy and no one likes consequences" thread? I was hoping to see if there were actual problems with DMing in the new rules that I forgot, not just the idea that PC power is a problem.

I've been on record many, many times saying that I am a "no-death" DM. It is a huge annoyance to me when PCs die, and so I try to avoid it whenever possible. But, I have a dirty little secret I rarely bring up on these forums. If I DID have death in my games? Then I'd likely TPK the party at least once an adventure, and I'd definitely (if I was setting out with the goal of killing player characters) have a hefty number of dead PCs. There have been multiple campaigns, and multiple characters where I have been sweating bullets, because a particularly hot or cold run of the dice has left me in a situation where I myself am not sure if the PCs can win the day. Where they barely scrape by because of a lucky crit, or a particularly clever tactic.

Now, I have also had many , many people online tell me that I am a terrible DM, that I don't know what I am doing, that I am not running DnD properly, ect. So, if I, a terrible no-skill DM who cares too much about story have nearly TPK'd multiple parties by accident... what's your excuse for not being able to challenge them?

Bonus Action potions? We've been using Bonus Action potions for years, heck WOTC acknowledged how many tables use bonus action potions. I know someone mentioned that they prefered it to be an action because it caused decisions, but we've long found the opposite. Whenever we have had action potions, they almost never get used. I actually was annoyed once to get a potion of Hill Giant Strength as treasure, not because my paladin couldn't use it, but because there was never a point where "wait, let me get a +2 to my attacks" was a good tactical decision, and since the potion didn't last very long, then I couldn't take it before the fight. The only time potions got used was after a fight (healing potions), during a fight if we need to force feed someone a healing potion so they didn't die, or before a fight if we could stand around and prep buffs. Which was incredibly rare. Personally? I love bonus action potions because that means I might see people actually use potions I give out as treasure.

But, I'm not going to leave people with no advice either, and there is one thing that a lot of DMs I've talked to have forgotten or just don't use. Remember, the hp on the monster statblock? That is the average hp. Without changing the CR, you can boost that HP up to the max, or below. Also, if you don't mind changing the CR... change the monster's equipment. It is a minor change that isn't too much work for the DM if they are like me and write down stats ahead of time so they aren't flipping through the book. Take an Ogre that has 11 AC with hide armor and a greatclub dealing 2d8+4, and swap it for some chainmail giving them an AC of 16 and a Greataxe that does 2d12+4. That is a major bump in the monster's strength with minimal homebrewing.

Honestly, I know people decry homebrewing monsters as a sign that WoTC has sinned and created more work for the poor DM... but frankly, once you get to high enough player levels... homebrewing is just a necessity. Not because WoTC is horrible and bad and evil, but because groups diverge from the mean. You can't challenge a party of paladins and clerics who have magical gear that boosts their defenses and healing, and feats that allow them to buff and empower their allies with the same monster than can challenge team nova strike whose characters have all built to deal as much damage as possible on round 1. There is just never going to be a one-size fits all for high level play.

There’s a whole video there (and some text) about how WotC seems to want to make running the game harder for the DM. Which has nothing to do with “5th ed is easy”.

Examples: Having more status effects to keep track of.

You (and others) might give the original post a re-read.

 

[mamba]

Speaking as a forever DM of my main group, I don't get the sense they're not. Many of the changes make the game more playable for the DM too. And we haven't seen any of the DMG or MM yet aside from art.

no idea, they certainly did not playtest the DMG or MM much. I am not expecting much there that will make the game easier to run, apart from monsters more consistently hitting their CR… what are you expecting that is new and helps (better organization does not count)?

 

[CapnZapp]

I don’t think difficult to kill PCs is a general GM frustration. I think it’s an old school frustration.

I think the idea GMs want to kill PCs is a kind of contempt directed at OSR.

The point is not to kill them. The point is being able to challenge them, without running through ever-more hoops to do so.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Sounds like a good time to jump ship.

Seriously folks. The water's fine out here. Plenty of other ships too.

 

[Micah Sweet]

A fresh relief from "this is the first character in the last 37 that actually lived to third level, I guess I should probably think of a name for them now..."

Yup, those are definitely your only two choices. It couldn't possibly be anything in between.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Everyone knows PCs are born tied up in the next room of the dungeon after your last PC was shanked by a kobold.

Can you guys ease up on the sarcasm and polarized views? I can't see a thing in here...

 

[Micah Sweet]

I mean...Yes at first glance and hearing the videos, it does sound like they are making the DM's job far harder...but they are only talking about the Players Handbook. At first I thought the same thing, I was pissed at how much harder they were making DMing and it was really disheartening, but then I remembered that they are redoing the Dungeon Master's Guide and the Monster Manual. So I don't know, or think really, that it's fair to say that they are making this game far easier than it already is. For the record, I played first growing up, so compared to first, 5th is FAR easier to me lol.

Is there a reason they have been pushing so hard on the PH material? There was no playtest stuff for the other books, and so far virtually no previews either. Hard not to draw the conclusion that players are what WotC cares about.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

As a DM I welcome the potion change.

How many times have enemies carried potions and drinking them was always a bad option, because it healed less than a round of incoming damage.

Now enemies can actually drink them. Double as much deadliness as the potions won't ever land in the PCs hands, as NPC drink them roght before their eyes.

Also players usually have enough time to plan ahead. It is tge npc who usually gets jumped. So drinking a fire resist potion mid combat helps them more.

Also, while PCs get more combat options, monsters seem to be buffed in that regard too. So probably it is a wash. But maybe some things are just a bit more interesting.


And last but not least: how can the game be harder to DM if you can just send monster after monster as much as you like.

 

[Charlaquin]

do you think that part of the DM’s job is to challenge them to the point that death is not completely impossible?

I definitely think that it’s part of the DM’s job is to present a challenge. But there are many kinds of challenges a DM can present, not all of which involve risk of character death. And if the DM does wish to present a challenge involving risk of character death, none of the changes that have been previewed so far prevent that.