D&D (2024) D&D 2024 Rules Oddities (Kibbles’ Collected Complaints)

So now it requires fighter levels impinging your basic class design
2024 would also want action surge. Nothing changes there.
and we are back to being in reality the damage is effectively halved because you are dividing it over 2 turns/actions
Same for both 2014 and 2024.

Though it's 3 actions. Spiked growth, haste, grapple. (+ dash, but that's can he a bonus or horse action)

So 500 / 3 = 166 damage per action.
and youi still haven;t solved the movement to get on your horse.
Why would you be off the horse?

Also. 2014 bards could grab find greater steed, for a 90' flying speed Pegasus. Something 2024 can't do anymore, so that’s another nerf bit of a nerf.
Also if we are including action surge then we need to consider 3 failed saves on the 2024 Monk example, without any other considerations.
You mean 3 save attempts.

2014 could have a monk riding a horse, with a 1 level dip for athletics expertise.
 
Last edited:

log in or register to remove this ad

The Sentinel Feat. It now allows the attack you make as a reaction using it to be an opportunity attack, meaning it applies the zero movement buff (I guess it didn't before, technically) so we have to remember that locking an enemy to zero movement with a single attack roll and no save.... does already exist.
Sentinel is a good feat (a very good one in D&D 2024), but not all that similar in practice. It being one swing, conditional, and melee changes things up a lot. Plus a lot of current monsters of that caliber (what we are using to test 2024 mostly currently due to necessity) can move as a Legendary Action, which works vs. Sentinel (since its to the end of the turn, not the whole round; you can only stop them once per round and they can try to move twice), so that makes it much less of a problem in testing. Maybe it will be different with 2024 monsters.

And it is interesting that you mention high level spells, because LOW level spells do allow this. Glimmering Smite, Blinding Smite, Ray of Sickness and I'm sure there are others. So... are all of those also problem spells? Are those also unintentional?
I don't know what Glimmering Smite is; if its in the book, I haven't seen it yet; could have missed it, but taking a quick look now I don't see it; should be right next to Glibness if my alphabeting is good (which it isn't), and I don't see it there.

Ray of Sickness is indeed on my list for a similar reason, though it only really begins the same degree of problem when combined with Summon Undead to Paralyze without a save. Harder to set up than Giant Insect, but in many cases even more problematic.

You need to read the dragon more carefully. It triggers on a legendary resistance... or being hit with a ranged attack.
That's a fair point! I did misread that; still puts a huge dent in the offensive CR and strips it off its most dangerous ability. If spells of much higher level than 4th cannot do that, it seems weird a 4th level spell can. Since we already know they made one typo in Giant Insect, it seems fair to call into question, but your mileage obviously may vary.

So you have seen the 2025 Monster Manual and can confirm that the web bolt ability does not exist on the Giant Spider in that book?
My point is that how the monster works isn't a good argument for how the player ability should work, and I'm not sure why it ever would be. Monster abilities have always worked different than PC abilities.

Ah, that was not how it was explained to me. It still doesn't activate again at the start of the creature's turn, so it will usually end up being half the damage it used to be.
Not at all, since you can do that damage on the turn when you cast it instead of the start of their turn; so doing the same thing will result in the same damage, you'll just deal it earlier. It's definitely seems like a more powerful spell now and I've yet to see anyone view it otherwise.

Anyway, anyone is free to make up their minds as they get the book, play the game, and try things out. This is just my list of problems after I've done just that. A light house on the rocky shoals of D&D 2024, if you will, so that less ships will run aground in their journey. If you are confident the rocks don't apply to you, sail onward bravely and heed not my words!

I'm not here to change hearts in minds (even if I did end up getting bogged in the line by line stuff I was trying to avoid!)
 

I don't know what Glimmering Smite is; if its in the book, I haven't seen it yet; could have missed it, but taking a quick look now I don't see it; should be right next to Glibness if my alphabeting is good (which it isn't), and I don't see it there.
They're referring to Shining Smite. Faerie Fire with no saving throw, only requiring an attack to land (which you get to land BEFORE deciding to cast the spell), it's quite strong much like the other spells you've referenced which don't require saving throws.
 

They're referring to Shining Smite. Faerie Fire with no saving throw, only requiring an attack to land (which you get to land BEFORE deciding to cast the spell), it's quite strong much like the other spells you've referenced which don't require saving throws.
Ah, yeah. Quite good. But definitely a different caliber, especially with advantage being so common in D&D 2024. Personally my rule of thumb is if that crowd control effects is where I draw the line of it having to have a save.

I strongly disliked Wall of Force and Forcecage for them being such powerful effects with no save in 5e 2014, so I'm very unexcited to see even more powerful effects (in some cases) showing up at much lower levels. Seeing if they'd nerfed Wall of Force was one of the first things I checked, only be crushingly disappointed it was exactly the same!
 

The only ways I can see it ending up there are that they did not care, they ran out of time, or they don't understand the crunchy interactions of the rules. I would bet on them running out of time... but that's not a great place to be for was supposed to be the clean up edition of the rules that was going to be the last edition of D&D we'd ever need. Maybe that's not something you rush out the door unfinished.
That was a great post. I just want to talk about this paragraph a bit.

The OGL fiasco delayed the playtest by months. Granted that was also their fault, but as it stands one of the 50th anniversary books is coming out in the 51st anniversary year. If they had pushed back the release to compensate for the delays in playtesting, none of the books for the 50th anniversary would have come out in the 50th anniversary year.

I don't like the sloppy work, either, and as I said it's still ultimately their fault, but if they had delayed it by months more, there would be an even greater outcry going on I think. Even if they damned themselves, they were still damned if you do, damned if you don't with this release.
 

So there is two ways to go about this. Either they read the UA comments, where a lot of people pointed that weapon toggled worked, and they intentionally left it in, or they didn't read the UA comments. Take your pick which outcome you believe! I choose to believe they didn't read the comments pointing it out, because they seem to be unaware of how it worked in interviews and articles, but that's just situational evidence.
I mean, they repeatedly told us that they had people reading through all of our comments. People were complaining that their comments weren't being read, so WotC reassured us that wasn't the case. That means that they lied to us about reading the comments, deliberately left in the problem, or meant to get rid of it and fumbled the ball on an easy play. None of that is a good look.
 

Regarding grappling and dragging.
In my group we have always played is so that the grappled target moves into the space vacated by the grappler. That reduced a lot of the shenanigans mentioned above.
I am not close to my 2014 rulebooks now and I haven't gotten the 2024 yet so I am not sure what the wording is and whether it is our added house rule or just our interpretation of what is written.
How we did it was that the grappling pair is in the same square. If you look around you while you stand and picture a 5 foot square that you are standing in, there's a huge amount of empty space. Two people wrestling will both be in the same 5 foot area, or the smaller will be in the larger creature's area if there is a size difference.
 

I hate this distinction, that it exists is insanity to me. I am not here to play word games or parse out if the author has a specific meaning for one word that is entirely different from that of another very similar word. Give me a clear rule instead of having me wonder what is meant by the RAW and if there is a difference because they used a synonym in another place instead of using the same word again.
Yep. It's not like the magic is paying attention to how the creature entered its area and is like, "Uh, oh! Someone pushed the creature into my area of effect and that's not fair. No damage for you!"
 


I find it deeply amusing that people think the changes to Spirit Guardians is some kind of OP buff.

Spirit Guardians now does damage once when the emanation enters a creature's space and when they end their turn in it. That is it. This means a cleric can run into a group of enemies and deal 3d8 damage. And if the enemies do not flee, they take 3d8 at the end of their turn. IF they do flee, no extra damage.

Do you know how it USED to work? People would use Telekinetic or Eldritch blast with Grasp of Hadar. They would stop right before the enemy, then hit them with those abilities, pulling them into the spirit guardians for 3d8 damage, then at the start of the creature's turn, they would take another 3d8 damage. Then on the next turn or as a reaction the caster would find a way to push them out or flee, then pull them back in, and they would repeat the process. They could also get allies to do the same, pulling the enemy out, and pushing them in.
Seeing this, I'm starting to wonder if the root problem here is forced movement in general, because it allows you to easily and repeatedly move someone into a hazard without exposing yourself to that same hazard.
 

Remove ads

Top