Zardnaar
Legend
Easier said than done.
I can run 2E and get players easily enough.
To play 2E I'm kicking rocks.
D&D (2024) Do players really want balance?
- Thread starter ECMO3
- Start date
Easier said than done.
I can run 2E and get players easily enough.
To play 2E I'm kicking rocks.
To folks saying that 5e is so huge because it's either 1. an incredibly designed game or 2. because it's so heavily marketed/advertised ... I guess it can be a bit of both?
It's well designed! I'd hardly say that it's the best designed TTRPG though, and we know that quality doesn't directly equal popularity. Again, it's good- it has a lot going for it. As someone else said, it has a ton of momentum and brand recognition. That's not the only things you need, obviously.
Buuut if all the same influences that buoyed DnD's popularity over the last ~8 or so years had happened during a different edition of DnD? I'm guessing we'd see the same level of popularity. Stranger Things and Critical Role were biiig influences.
The suggestion that the quality of a system is reflected in its retention is a great point! Other things that can add to retention: momentum/popularity, investment, and walled gardens:
"Everyone's playing DnD, so I guess I'll play DnD;" "I have all these DnD books and I learned all the rules, I don't really want to buy and learn a new game;" and DnDBeyond. Holy crud DnDBeyond is a huge factor in retaining players, for multiple reasons but we really don't need to get into that again here
It's well designed! I'd hardly say that it's the best designed TTRPG though, and we know that quality doesn't directly equal popularity. Again, it's good- it has a lot going for it. As someone else said, it has a ton of momentum and brand recognition. That's not the only things you need, obviously.
Buuut if all the same influences that buoyed DnD's popularity over the last ~8 or so years had happened during a different edition of DnD? I'm guessing we'd see the same level of popularity. Stranger Things and Critical Role were biiig influences.
The suggestion that the quality of a system is reflected in its retention is a great point! Other things that can add to retention: momentum/popularity, investment, and walled gardens:
"Everyone's playing DnD, so I guess I'll play DnD;" "I have all these DnD books and I learned all the rules, I don't really want to buy and learn a new game;" and DnDBeyond. Holy crud DnDBeyond is a huge factor in retaining players, for multiple reasons but we really don't need to get into that again here
Vaalingrade
Legend
To quote 5e's 'brilliant design' -- roll twice and ask your DM.
Mod Note:
One of the mysteries of life.
Like, the mystery of why you, who have been around so long, would think making this personal would be a good idea for you.
You should know better. You're done in this discussion.
MichaelSomething
Legend
I've also advocate for DM apprenticeship programs. I suggest you start advertising and taking applications for new 2E DMs!
Yeah except there is experimental evidence to back up the first, but not the latter.
Zardnaar
Legend
I'm not that fanatic about it. 2E great toolbox for DMs. I have the books they're not cheap or easy to aquire now.
My trainee DM ran CoS. Next game might be his.
To folks saying that 5e is so huge because it's either 1. an incredibly designed game or 2. because it's so heavily marketed/advertised ... I guess it can be a bit of both?
It's well designed! I'd hardly say that it's the best designed TTRPG though, and we know that quality doesn't directly equal popularity. Again, it's good- it has a lot going for it. As someone else said, it has a ton of momentum and brand recognition. That's not the only things you need, obviously.
Buuut if all the same influences that buoyed DnD's popularity over the last ~8 or so years had happened during a different edition of DnD? I'm guessing we'd see the same level of popularity. Stranger Things and Critical Role were biiig influences.
The suggestion that the quality of a system is reflected in its retention is a great point! Other things that can add to retention: momentum/popularity, investment, and walled gardens:
"Everyone's playing DnD, so I guess I'll play DnD;" "I have all these DnD books and I learned all the rules, I don't really want to buy and learn a new game;" and DnDBeyond. Holy crud DnDBeyond is a huge factor in retaining players, for multiple reasons but we really don't need to get into that again here
Couple of things. First, there is no perfect game. Even if it did exist, it would vary from one person to the next. Second, there was minimal correlation of sales increase with either Stranger Things or Critical Role (there was a chart somewhere on this forum that showed estimated growth, the upward trend didn't change much). Remember, it took CR a while to gain many followers. In addition, Matt switched over from PF to D&D 5E because he thought it played and presented better so it's kind of a chicken and the egg thing there.
Obviously there are many, many influences on D&D's success. We can't underestimate the impact of the acceptance of gaming (video or TTRPG) and the resurgence of fantasy along with many people feeling disconnected and wanting a more face-to-face connection. Then there was COVID ... on and on. But virtually any game could have taken advantage of a lot of this, they didn't. There are a lot of D&D streams that are popular and relatively few streams that are as popular that use other systems. Is that caused by the approach of other systems? Is the approach a big part of the appeal?
We just don't really know and never will. All I know is that I, and the people I play with, have fun and I have no problem attracting players if I need to. That's all that really matters to me.
ezo
Hero
Not so easy when people have already invested money in 2-3 rulebooks each already. Also, do you have an extra 2-3 copies of the 2E PHB lying around?? I don't.
Sure... you have dozens of RPG groups where you live? I don't. I'm lucky to have the one I've got! The second one I had recently disbanded.
I love the flippant attitude people take with this...
cbwjm
Seb-wejem
I have a number of 2e (and 3e now that I think of it) books at my mum's place, I'll soon be shipping them to my new place and I'm really looking forward to flipping through them again.
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