D&D (2024) 2024 Artificer

[abirdcall]

Yeah, I think WotC over-valued the Infusion thingy because they went with the base assumptions that magic items aren't mandatory to the game while most games are more generous with magic items loot/crafting/shop.

With the comming of the new magic crafting rules and feats, full casters will definitely have an edge over the artificer.

A knowledge cleric who can swap in new tool proficiencies and has Expertise can be a great item crafter and a support full spellcaster.

Or a Bard who can poach from other spell lists to access the best spells enchant on an item, with Expertise in Arcana and prof with Tools from feat or background.

I think they're still going to be in a similar position.

Crafting magic items still aren't a mandatory part of the game. There will be more comprehensive rules for them but they are still in the DM's hands.

It keeps artificer in a weird place. I wouldn't be surprised if they were to overhaul them when they eventually get updated.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

I think they're still going to be in a similar position.

Crafting magic items still aren't a mandatory part of the game. There will be more comprehensive rules for them but they are still in the DM's hands.

It keeps artificer in a weird place. I wouldn't be surprised if they were to overhaul them when they eventually get updated.

Yeah, I think favoring Infusions that can't be replicated by magic items of the DMG is the way to-go.

And the idea of giving them the warlock chassis (infusions = invocations) with Short Rest spells is a good idea. It fits the them of jury-rigging quick spells effects and their Incarnum-equivalent could be called Projects and include high level creation spells live Fabricate, Instant Fortress, Magnificent Mansion, Walls of X etc.

 

[Tales and Chronicles]

Oh, I forgot

The whole magic-items-as-BA and the wand charges economy features need to be on the Articifer.

This would be a much needed boost to versatility, resources and power.

 

[mellored]

How do the new crafting rules apply with to the Artificers tools?

 

[MarkB]

How do the new crafting rules apply with to the Artificers tools?

To craft a magic item you need to meet 2-3 requirements.

1. Proficiency in the Arcana skill .
2. Proficiency in the tools required to craft the physical item (i.e. woodcarving tools for a wand, smithing tools for a sword).
3. If the item casts a spell, you need to have that spell prepared each day you are crafting it.

So, the tools come in for point 2. I don't think tool expertise plays into it, as you don't need to actually roll any checks, you just need to meet the requirements and put in the hours to complete the item.

 

[Jefe Bergenstein]

I think "niche class" is more applicable than "weak class". The issue was how much people focus on damage when they're a support class.

The problem is then they're competing with the bard and cleric, which are full casters with extra support on top of it. The infusions don't make up for it, given how stingy they are with the allowed effects at a particular level.

WOTC dropped the ball by not having individual class lists with spells at different levels for different classes. The half casters damage spells in particular need to be dropped. Fireball is meaningful at 5th level. Its a tickle at 9th level. They could have made it a 2nd level artificer spell. Same with crap like hail of thorns, which is just irritating busywork. Don't make me roll a bunch of saves for half damage on a single digit AE.

 

[Umbran]

I see the Battle Smith pet as a defining characteristic more.

From playing one, no. Infused weapons that you use your Int bonus to hit and damage and get extra attacks with end up being quite potent.

Sure, you can cast a spell in combat, but as a half caster, your combat options there are usually unimpressive. Actually just fighting works pretty well.

 

[Merlecory]

I've slept on it, and remembered another thing about the artificer that kinda irks me:

Their spellcasting is described as them inventing things on the fly. Mechanically though, it is practically identical to literally every other spellcaster. There is a big divide between the described fiction and the mechanics of the game. I can't imagine that it would happen on a refresh, but I'd love to see some attempt to bring those closer in line with each other.

Maybe Artificers become fully Vancian casters, preparing their inventions at the start of the day. That's weaker to be sure, but more in line with what is described.

 

[abirdcall]

I've slept on it, and remembered another thing about the artificer that kinda irks me:

Their spellcasting is described as them incentive things on the fly. Mechanically though, it is practically identical to literally every other spellcaster. There is a big divide between the described fiction and the mechanics of the game. I can't imagine that it would happen on a refresh, but I'd love to see some attempt to bring those closer in line with each other.

Maybe Artificers become fully Vancian casters, preparing their inventions at the start of the day. That's weaker to be sure, but more in line with what is described.

That is my biggest issue with the class.

 

[Merlecory]

WOTC dropped the ball by not having individual class lists with spells at different levels for different classes. The half casters damage spells in particular need to be dropped. Fireball is meaningful at 5th level. Its a tickle at 9th level. They could have made it a 2nd level artificer spell. Same with crap like hail of thorns, which is just irritating busywork. Don't make me roll a bunch of saves for half damage on a single digit AE.

Do you mean something like wizards and sorcerers could cast fireball as a 3rd level spell, but Artificers would be able to cast it as a 2nd level spell?