D&D General The Monsters Know What They're Doing ... Are Unsure on 5e24

[tetrasodium]

that was tried a few times and the answer was ‘to play a tortle’, at which point there is no compromise possible and the player is out.

It probably didn’t help that no one insisting on playing a tortle did so because they actually wanted to play one but only did so for the sake of the argument

I think that the disconnect is one of willingness to feel comfortable enough being honest with the answer lurking behind that. The closest we probably got was when someone brought up a desire to play an anthropomorphic turtle without using the more common slang term for it.

Spoiler: That right there..

AI Overview



+5
What is Anthropomorphism? — Definition and Examples
There isn't one single slang term for anthropomorphic, but the closest and most common informal term is "anthro", short for anthropomorphic, often used within the furry fandom to describe human-like animal characters, while "furry" refers to the fandom itself or a person interested in such characters, and terms like "humanoid" describe creatures with a basic human shape (two arms, two legs) even if not animal-like, but slang for the act of anthropomorphizing often involves calling something a "talking animal" or "humanized" in casual speech.

Nearly any other race aside from gnoll or tabaxi would entirely sidestep this entire chasm of stonewalling around the actual desire save for perhaps dragonborn harengon and kobold.

When the impasse is "because the player is a furry and wants to play that but won't admit it so the gm knows what they want" it results in a problem that is 100% on the player being unreasonable by not telling the gm enough to even consider how it could be fit to the setting.

Note: I've seen more than one show up to the local FLGS AL night to play in full costume before and nobody really cared beyond the fact that a foam helmet covering their face made it very very difficult to hear them with reasonable volume levels till they took it off and set it aside . I'm quite sure there are others less extravagantly dressed showing week after week and nobody cares, but GMs are not mind readers

 

[TwoSix]

I encourage people to play and run the games they find fun. I absolutely deny that we, or anyone, should be encouraging the wider hobby to adopt and approve of a single style above others.

We should recognize that some game systems are better for some styles than others.

If you’re playing Dolmenwood, you absolutely should NOT be cosmopolitan and allow a bunch of weird races.

If you’re playing D&D, you absolutely should. D&D is meant to provide a wide amount of options to the players and use setting frames that support that diversity.

 

[Scribe]

I have been struggling for a while with the traditional intelligent monster species as wilderness encounter fodder.

Patrols, Raiding Parties, Bandits, Mercenaries, Rebels? Plenty of options.

 

[SableWyvern]

I think that the disconnect is one of willingness to feel comfortable enough being honest with the answer lurking behind that. The closest we probably got was when someone brought up a desire to play an anthropomorphic turtle without using the more common slang term for it.

Spoiler: That right there..

AI Overview



+5
What is Anthropomorphism? — Definition and Examples
There isn't one single slang term for anthropomorphic, but the closest and most common informal term is "anthro", short for anthropomorphic, often used within the furry fandom to describe human-like animal characters, while "furry" refers to the fandom itself or a person interested in such characters, and terms like "humanoid" describe creatures with a basic human shape (two arms, two legs) even if not animal-like, but slang for the act of anthropomorphizing often involves calling something a "talking animal" or "humanized" in casual speech.

Nearly any other race aside from gnoll or tabaxi would entirely sidestep this entire chasm of stonewalling around the actual desire save for perhaps dragonborn harengon and kobold.

When the impasse is "because the player is a furry and wants to play that but won't admit it so the gm knows what they want" it results in a problem that is 100% on the player being unreasonable by not telling the gm enough to even consider how it could be fit to the setting.

Note: I've seen more than one show up to the local FLGS AL night to play in full costume before and nobody really cared beyond the fact that a foam helmet covering their face made it very very difficult to hear them with reasonable volume levels till they took it off and set it aside . I'm quite sure there are others less extravagantly dressed showing tweek after week and nobody cares, but GMs are not mind readers

Really?

Telling people who disagree with you that it's probably just because they're closet furries is going to advance the conversation how? This is no better than claiming a GM who curates their game lacks vision and clearly just wants to run a scripted railroad.

 

[Belen]

I encourage people to play and run the games they find fun. I absolutely deny that we, or anyone, should be encouraging the wider hobby to adopt and approve of a single style above others.

“You, over there with the bad, wrong, fun.”

It may not be intended but comes off as the “our preference is morally superior.”

Allowing a kitchen sink has no morality attached to it. The kitchen sink has been around for decades. It is an old concept and is one way to play.

I am not a fan of one true way ideology.

Have I run kitchen sink games? Yes. They can be fun.

Would I make every game kitchen sink? Nope. At times, I want to run with certain themes or styles and kitchen sink usually only supports very high fantasy.

 

[Scott Christian]

The primary reason I can think of is that I got the idea for a wise old turtle druid and I don't know when, if ever, I will get to play him. Maybe I saw a character from a movie who inspired me. Maybe I found a cool mini or picture online. Maybe I really like turtles and I'm bored or elves and dwarves. That's true for a lot of players who only play in one game or with one DM (and who rarely even switch worlds to give different options). If that DM is the only DM I play with and that's the only setting he ever runs, I will never get the chance to play that character.

Those are all great reasons to want to play a tortle. And you are correct, if that is the only DM you play with, and they don't allow tortles, then you will not get a chance to play one. And you are correct, some DMs never switch up their world. So, you're stuck.

I think my flaw on this thinking is assuming that I need to be DM shopping to play the character I want. That just because I want to try something new, I need to abandon my current group and find a new one and hope that DM is more permissive while also adjusting to a new group and DM who will have different quirks. Hell, I may need to leave a group of friends to game with strangers just to try out my idea. (Then again, if my group would rather I leave then play a Tortle, I'm pretty sure they weren't friends)

But, you are not stuck with this. You can find different groups. Even moderate cities of 50,000 people have many groups. Game stores exist. If you are the rare exception of living in the small town with no options (like some small Alaskan village with no internet), then your DM should let you. But let's face it, that is a very rare occurrence in a world where thousands of online groups exist, thousands of in-person groups exist, paid groups exist, and groups start up every week from scheduled play.

And it is false that you are "abandoning my current group." You can play with two groups. One, where your tortle fits in, and one where your tortle is not allowed.

And please, stop being dramatic. It's not about whether people are "your friends." Friends can disagree about playstyles. We used to all the time when we were young. "Too many magic items," from one DM. "You can't play an orc in a Middle Earth campaign," from another. "I want to play this system," and "I want to play this other system," from someone else. "Leave the sci-fi out of it," from a player. "I want more sci-fi," from a different player. That happens all the time. Deal with it. Play for six months in a system you don't like or a sci-fi campaign. It will not kill you. In fact, it might even help you appreciate it.

 

[Umbran]

tl;dr 'Wehweh I don't wanna see a green dude as a hero in my brain theater wehweh'

Mod Note:
tl;dr "I figured the three other warnings in this thread didn't mean I also had to be respectful, so I got removed from the discussion."

 

[Remathilis]

If a DM invited you to play a dhampir bloodmage in a campaign where all PCs are asked to play dhampirs of human origin, would you participate in that campaign designed for formerly-human dhampir PCs? Or would you turn down that invitation to play a dhampir bloodmage because the DM isn't offering more species options?

Ouch.

I'm not a fan of one species games in general. If the DM was trying to do Vampire: that Dark Ages using 5e rules, i'd question why they are using D&D and not Storyteller. But if the DM was interested in augmenting the limited species with a larger selection of classes and such (things like Crooked Moon or blood hunters) I would consider it. If it was PHB only and dhampir, I'd probably decline but you might be able to sway me if your pitch was good enough.

See, I can compromise...

 

[mamba]

Are these not compromises?

not really, these were suggestions for how they could play a tortle. Given that playing a tortle was the initial idea, nothing was being compromised

 

[tetrasodium]

Really?

Telling people who disagree with you that it's probably just because they're closet furries is going to advance the conversation how? This is no better than claiming a GM who curates their game lacks vision and clearly just wants to run a scripted railroad.

Quite the opposite. My local AL community has a huge number of them and a big part of it is because they aren't treated like they should be ashamed of it like you just implied. They keep showing up being nerdy d&d players paying the shop hosting a whole room of tables and chairs§ their 2$ . There is a whole lot of coded language like anthropomorphic that gets used by those players to check for acceptance and I've seen quite a few examples that look to very very much be channeling the same stuff throughout the thread in the tortle or bust posts.

§gms get nothing but don't generally get asked to pay either.