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tetrasodium

Legend
Supporter
Epic
Well, “ok but could be better” would still contribute positively to the satisfaction score. Unless you tried to express “ok” with the “dissatisfied” option. But this has publicly been their UA process for decades, so folks should know by now: vote “very satisfied” if you want it as-presented. Vote “satisfied” if you like the idea but want to see it tweaked. Vote “very dissatisfied” if you don’t like it and don’t want them to pursue it further. The “dissatisfied” has pretty minimal utility, basically just for things you don’t like but could live with in some form.
No it would not be certain to contribute to positive if the responder doesn't feel confident in what wotc is wanting feedback on and after several years of 5e druids still being punished for codzilla they don't have faith in wotc correcting a set of numbers such an obvious pants on head failure of design that should have been caught by even the barest most cursory skim through by anyone along the chain at wotc. That is an entirely reasonable pov for a responder to have because Wotc never bothered to clarify anything wrt intent no matter how heated the debate got.


Even beyond that this touches on well documented polling science. There are lots of areas where research has been done on the phenomena of respondents answering wildly different depending on the question asked and if the thing is summarized or the individual components of the thing are asked going both ways depending on issue and question wording. edit: There are a lot of flavors that fall under that response bias & given how badly the process is handled on a technical level most or all of them could be applied. I'd not be surprised if the milgram experiment also demonstrates an impact* created by the assumption of polling experts versed in d&d/ttrpgs running the show with the 70% threshold marketed do heavily

*maybe now, but definitely used as a shield to fight GM efforts later should the GM want to make houserule(s) that could result in a nerf or reduction in power for a PC somewhere in play.
 
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Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
I'd say you stick with what all 5 kids like. 3 kids didn't like a particular thing, and 2 kids didn't like another particular thing but they all like whats normally for lunch. You wouldn't have to make them skip lunch at that point.
You're screwing 5 kids out the lunch they got as a reward, which is a fantastic method of teaching kids not to put in the effort. That's a less than optimal solution to that dilemma.
 

Maxperson

Morkus from Orkus
Since the days of "Magic User", the Wizard class includes many different kinds of character concepts, including the innate spellcaster.
Can you explain that better? I've been playing since 1e and magic users have always had VSM. There were no options for magic users to go innate and not use VSM, so from what I can see any such concept had to close its eyes and ignore the reality of spell components.
 

is there a ‘not’ too many in here?

I assume there is, I am not sure what you are trying to say with it even then, or you are referring to a different case than me

Probably. :/

I rephrase it:

A like in this poll is not automatically a dislike for the old ability and vice versa.

Two different scales.

I think you were one of those implying or saying that if 60% like the new ability, that means there is a majority who prefers the new version over the old version. Which is not necessarily true (or false).
 

tetrasodium

Legend
Supporter
Epic
Can you explain that better? I've been playing since 1e and magic users have always had VSM. There were no options for magic users to go innate and not use VSM, so from what I can see any such concept had to close its eyes and ignore the reality of spell components.
He's probably talking about the optional 2e rule on
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Unfortunately in it's efforts to ensure that the things are so loose wrt what's in your hands & the failure to be explicit about needing as focus or loudly/with pourpose/etc for verbal 5e kinda makes this sort of thing awkward to even make into a meaningful change during actual play.
 


mamba

Legend
The polls aren’t on a 1-5 scale. There are 4 options: very satisfied, satisfied, dissatisfied, and very dissatisfied.
my bad, should stick to the descriptions… so how do you differentiate dissatisfied between ‘do not want this’ and ‘needs improvement’, or should the latter always vote satisfied?

If you’ve given feedback on any Unearthed Arcana throughout 5e’s run, you’ve seen this before.
and what percentage do you think is that?
 

Mistwell

Crusty Old Meatwad (he/him)
I don’t follow, the 60% is not enough to clear the 70% threshold, so it gets rejected. In other words the 40% prevented the 60% majority opinion.

What the majority chose did not make it in. You found the option, you did not use it…
Oh my goodness, again with subtracting the lower number from the higher number?

Look, there is no logic to what you're doing. You're saying if a person likes two things equally you only count one thing they like and don't count the other. It's just complete nonsense. There is zero mathematical basis for what you're doing.

If I ask 10 units of people if they like the color green and 6 say yes and 4 say no, and then I ask the same group of people if they like blue and 8 say yes and 2 say no, it is not in fact 2 people making the decision. It is 100% fact that most of the people who liked the green, ALSO liked the blue. People can, and do, like multiple things. People "on your side" are liking the other thing also. You're entirely discounting them liking the other thing because it doesn't agree with your preferences, with no explanation for why you're doing that other than just asserting their votes don't count at all for the second thing for...reasons?
 



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