D&D (2024) 4/26 Playtest: The Sorceror

[Yaarel]

That's completely fair.

And there is something to be said for not cluttering up a sheet with things that will just be forgotten.

Heh, what some players call "ribbon", I call "pollution".

I strongly prefer elegant design, and dont want unwanted extraneity.

Some ribbons do a good job at being great flavor without mechanical power. But the game works better when those who want the flavor can get it, and those who dont want it can remain uncluttered without it.

 

[Incenjucar]

It would be so much better to give the player a choice between a randomized version, a common static type version, a weaker choose-common-at-cast version, and a weaker rare static type version.

Also the randomized version should probably still be the 7 standard damage types, and put the exploding effect in the type roll.

 

[Frozen_Heart]

Honestly not a fan of the new sorcerer. I mean it's better than the PHB 5e version, but that's not saying much. The subclass is a huge step back from the Tasha's subclasses, with the lack of origin spells punishing players who want to play towards their theme.

I was also hoping for spell points, but as they're doing the reverse and removing warlock's unique casting, I guess that's never going to happen.

It feels like they're trying to put all the theme and power onto the sorcerer's base class, and none onto the subclass. While personally I'd like sorcerers to have the most impactful subclasses.

 

[Chaosmancer]

One, the gambling element is fun, I'm quite eager to cast the spell. Two ... admittedly, not too many monsters have elemental vulnerabilities, but this is one of very few spells that always find those opportunities and dodge elemental resistances.

Though if the spell does need buffing, why not just have it start at 2d6 and scale from there?

Oh, I absolutely love the concept of the spell, don't get me wrong. I just think it needs a minor damage buff. 2d6 with exploding 6's might swing it too far, that's better than most any cantrip in the game.

I think d8's would be just fine.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Honestly not a fan of the new sorcerer. I mean it's better than the PHB 5e version, but that's not saying much. The subclass is a huge step back from the Tasha's subclasses, with the lack of origin spells punishing players who want to play towards their theme.

I was also hoping for spell points, but as they're doing the reverse and removing warlock's unique casting, I guess that's never going to happen.

It feels like they're trying to put all the theme and power onto the sorcerer's base class, and none onto the subclass. While personally I'd like sorcerers to have the most impactful subclasses.

The lack of origin spells is frustrating, but I think they were imagining that the extra seven spells known would cover for it. Overall though... I can't say I hate the new draconic bloodline.

Level 3 -> Bonus hp and MASSIVE AC buff (seriously, you will go from a likely AC of 12 to an AC of 15, potentially maxing at 17 or 18 AC.) The draconic speech is a ribbon.

Level 6 -> Elemental resistance and cha-mod damage to all spells? With no cost? That ain't bad.

Level 10 -> At-will elemental cone attack? If I get my way on the damage changes, that is a 15 ft cone of 3d8+mod, at-will. Sure, it is seperate attack rolls, but that is still pretty dang good.

Meaning the only real miss is the level 14. It should be permanent flight, and the spell should give the free aura damage. Or maybe don't tie the spell to the damage and just be able to activate it for a couple of points for a minute.

And other than Twin spell, every single metamagic got a good buff. And they are far easier to get and swap


Do I wish we had spell points? Absolutely. But overall... I could be happy with this. Ecstatic? No, but this is solid. Of course, I still haven't read the wizard yet, and that will probably make me weep bitter tears, but I'll take what hope I can at this point.

 

[Kinematics]

Level 3 -> Bonus hp and MASSIVE AC buff (seriously, you will go from a likely AC of 12 to an AC of 15, potentially maxing at 17 or 18 AC.) The draconic speech is a ribbon.

Not quite that massive. The original version was 13+Dex, not 10+Dex, so it essentially already baked in the expected +3 from a starting 16 Cha. It does still go up, though. So the starting AC will likely be the same 15 or so, but can easily reach 17-18.

So a nice, but not massive buff.

Meaning the only real miss is the level 14. It should be permanent flight, and the spell should give the free aura damage.

Yeah, I was reviewing some of the other subclasses, and realized flight is very common for sorcerers.

Draconic: Permanent flight (walking speed)
Divine Soul: Permanent flight (30')
Storm Sorcerer: Permanent flight (60'), sharable (30')
Aberrant Mind: 10 minutes of flight (walking speed) for 1 sorcery point (plus other possible modifications)

The UA Draconic only getting flight for 1 minute, at walking speed, at the cost of a 5th level spell and concentration, is way out of whack compared to the other subclasses, unless they're planning to nerf flight in general.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Not quite that massive. The original version was 13+Dex, not 10+Dex, so it essentially already baked in the expected +3 from a starting 16 Cha. It does still go up, though. So the starting AC will likely be the same 15 or so, but can easily reach 17-18.

So a nice, but not massive buff.

Sorry, I mean massive in terms of level 2 to level 3, you are right it isn't so big compared to 2014

Yeah, I was reviewing some of the other subclasses, and realized flight is very common for sorcerers.

Draconic: Permanent flight (walking speed)
Divine Soul: Permanent flight (30')
Storm Sorcerer: Permanent flight (60'), sharable (30')
Aberrant Mind: 10 minutes of flight (walking speed) for 1 sorcery point (plus other possible modifications)

The UA Draconic only getting flight for 1 minute, at walking speed, at the cost of a 5th level spell and concentration is way out of whack compared to the other subclasses, unless they're planning to nerf flight in general.

They are probably once again in a panic over flight and how (not) utterly overpowered it is.

I'll probably once more put into the survey that flight is not this thing they need to nerf out of existence, it is usually perfectly fine. Especially since so much of the utility of it is available to basically anyone at 1st level.

 

[Vael]

So ... Twin Spell.

I agree, it's busted powerful and needs a nerf. But I'll confess that the new version doesn't feel like Twin Spell, to me it feels like it should be named Echo Spell, Repeat Spell or Cascade Spell.

Twin breaks 3 things:

• Action Economy - two spells in a turn
• Concentration Limit - several single target spells can do double their effectiveness
• Efficiency - Only paying Sorcery points equal to level means it's more efficient than using those same points to make another spell slot.

The new Twin goes for Efficiency, but tbh, it's Action Economy that entices me. So, while I'd keep the new Twin, but with a different name, I'd offer this for a new Twin Spell:

Twin Spell
When casting a spell that does not have concentration, you can cast it twice by expending another spell slot of the same level and two sorcery points (Or just two sorcery points for a cantrip). No creature can be the targets of both spells and the spells cannot both effect the same area.

 

[Chaosmancer]

I've never really been that convinced that Twin is broken. Was it the absolute most powerful metamagic? Yes, because most of them sucked. I also think the angle being looked at... it misses something for me.

For example. I don't get why everyone keeps saying you get to cast two spells. You don't. You get to target two creatures. And this is an important distinction to me, especially since many single target spells at lower levels upcast by targeting more creatures, meaning it didn't actually feel that much cheaper to me in the long run.

I will agree it breaks concentration (sort of) because you can double the effect, but you also had two concentrations to lose as well.

The problem I initially had with your proposal was that it would make the sorcerer even more of a blaster, but looking at it again, you are allowing two casts of the same AOE. And that is probably too much. You could effectively cast two spells at that point, because anything that doesn't overlap hits.

 

[Milieu]

Arcane Eruption is actually really good. At 6d6 damage (practically any type you want), and you only need 1 1 on a d6 to incapaciate everyone you target, that is very very good. And even if you miss that, blinding everyone is still pretty solid.

I was curious about the distribution of options, so I ran the numbers. Rolling 6d6, there are 6^6 = 46656 results.

# of options	Count	Probability
1	6	~0.013%
2	930	2.0%
3	10800	23%
4	23400	50%
5	10800	23%
6	720	~1.5%

As you can see, the vast majority of the time, you'll be able to pick from 3-5 of the 6 options. If you want 1 particular option, you have ~66.5% chance of being able to choose it.