A few questions about Chain Spell

[Thanee]

1a) Can you chain beneficial spells (i.e. chained haste)?

1b) Is there any 'power reduction' for beneficial spells (the feat only mentions lowered damage and saves)?

2) Can you chain spells that can have but must not have a single target (i.e. chained flame arrow, when targeting all arrows at a single target)? Of course, the chain effect will not work if more than a single target is specified.

3) Can you chain spells that can mimic other spells, from which some have a single target but others have not (i.e. chained shadow evocation)? Of course, the chain effect will not work if you mimic a spell that has more than a single target.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Crothian]

Which chain spell we talking about? There is one in R&R and one in T&B, and they are different.

 

[Thanee]

The one from Tome & Blood.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Crothian]

1a) Can you chain beneficial spells (i.e. chained haste)?

1b) Is there any 'power reduction' for beneficial spells (the feat only mentions lowered damage and saves)?

2) Can you chain spells that can have but must not have a single target (i.e. chained flame arrow, when targeting all arrows at a single target)? Of course, the chain effect will not work if more than a single target is specified.

3) Can you chain spells that can mimic other spells, from which some have a single target but others have not (i.e. chained shadow evocation)? Of course, the chain effect will not work if you mimic a spell that has more than a single target.

Bye
Thanee

1a) Yes.

1b) Doesn't seem to. I think there should be though, but that would be a house rule.

2) I'm not sure of the question

3) AS long as it has a single target, it will work.

 

[Thanee]

Thanks for your answers so far.

On 2) Take Flame Arrow 12th caster level as example. You get 3 arrows that you can either shoot at a single target or multiple targets.

If I memorize a chained Flame Arrow (if that is possible, which is basically my question) and shoot all three arrows at the same target, does this spell then qualify for being chained, and I can choose secondary targets as well, or does the mere possibility, that multiple targets could be selected, negate the use of Chain Spell for this spell?

So, does the feat Chain Spell only work on spells that cannot have more than one target, or does it work on spells, when they are cast on only one target, altho multiple targets would be possible with that spell (i.e. Flame Arrow, or Magic Missile)?

Bye
Thanee

 

[Taren Seeker]

Well, we've been using Chain for quite a while now for things like Magic Missile, Focused Dispel Magic and GMW. My group has looked through the relevant books, and couldn't find anything to forbid it, and since the spells specify that you can opt to affect one target, it seems to be allowed. You might have a problem with spells that don't specifically mention a single target in the Target entry, which could rule out Flame Arrow. YMMV.

As for your initial example of Haste, well sure, it's just a Mass Haste. Since the +3 lvls requirement of Chain works out in this example (mass haste) and for Fly (you can't chain fly, but Mass Fly is 6th), I think the beneficial uses of Chain is intended.

It's a great meta feat, one of the more versatile ones out there. Both our regular cleric and wizard swear by it.

 

[Thanee]

Yes, it really seems to add a lot of versatility!

Would be even better for a sorcerer, but even for a wizard it looks pretty nice!

Bye
Thanee

 

[Xarlen]

I have a few questions my self.

How do you decide how many arcs you get?

In the case of Magic Missile (Which does 5d4+5 damage at 10th level) would hit with five missiles. If it's chained, then what's the damage? 3d4+3? What's half of 5d4+5?

How are spells that are range-touch? Does the person have to be touching?

 

[Thanee]

Dunno for sure about secondary ranged touch attacks, I guess you will only have to hit your initial target.

As for the damage... 5d4+5 / 2.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Pax]

1a) Can you chain beneficial spells (i.e. chained haste)?

Nothngin the rules forbids it.

1b) Is there any 'power reduction' for beneficial spells (the feat only mentions lowered damage and saves)?

The rules actually only specify halving if the spell deals damage measured in dice ... strongly implying that non-damaging spells, even HARMFUL ones, ar not reduced in effect ata ll, and that flat-damage spells (few and far between, especially once Touch spells like HArm are taken out of the picture) are not reduced in damage dealt.

It is the dice of damage, not the damage itself, which is halved.

As an ugly aside -- with the right Prestie Classes, picture a Chain Vampiric Touch (I mention prestige classses specifically because some, i.e. the Archmage in FRCS, essentially turn Touch spells into 30-foot-range ray spells, and some DMs might rule that renders them viable for modification with Chain Spell; YMMV, of course). Very ugly, even with half dice to secondary targets.

2) Can you chain spells that can have but must not have a single target (i.e. chained flame arrow, when targeting all arrows at a single target)? Of course, the chain effect will not work if more than a single target is specified.

Flame arrow eithr affects a certai number of arows, period, OR, one target for 4d6 direct damage. The second application is open to use of the Chain Spell feat as presented in T&B; secondary targets wudl take 2d6.

3) Can you chain spells that can mimic other spells, from which some have a single target but others have not (i.e. chained shadow evocation)? Of course, the chain effect will not work if you mimic a spell that has more than a single target.

Bye
Thanee

Absolutely, IMO -- the Chain benefit will come into effect ONLY if and s the ACTUAL spell mimicked, would itself qualify for the Chain Spell metamagic. Otherwise, the metamagic-cost inlevel increase was wasted.