D&D General A History of Violence: Killing in D&D

[Thomas Shey]

Notably, many game systems do advancement on a strict per session basis.

13th Age at least theoretically so, for example (in practice, its actually every 16 "encounters" but that's supposed to be about four sessions if things go right). Fragged Empire and its offshoots I believe do it every three.

 

[Micah Sweet]

No. You can have it based on X sessions, when X time has passed in-game, or any number of other things. It doesn't have to be entirely ad-hoc.

Those methods are even more narrative or gamist. At least with xp you're doing something to earn it.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Notably, many game systems do advancement on a strict per session basis.

Yeah. I kinda hate it.

 

[Guest 85555]

I am pretty open when it comes to progression methods. These days I tailor it to the campaign I am running

 

[Gradine]

Of course not!

It's 500 pages, and I use endnotes

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

With regards to Murder-hobos:
It's my understanding that the original concept of the murder hobo was that PCs had no back stories (I have no family, i'm a loner) and no ties to the community. They were just roaming the countryside killing things and taking their stuff. NOT that they were stabbing the local merchants with impunity.

I could be wrong.

Well, as I noted in the original post, the term murderhobo is actually really recent! I know, shocking!

However, the idea of that type of play has long roots. In the 1970s, it was common to have shopkeepers "statted up" or to have them be, inter alia, polymorphed gold dragons in order to deter players from randomly killing shopkeepers and taking their stuff.

 

[Micah Sweet]

As I noted, it doesn't have to be narrative based at all (unless you're using "narrative" so broadly that simply running the game counts for it).

Advancing your PC for any reason other than actions that PC has accomplished, even as an abstraction, is either too narrative (based on the "story" you're telling) or too gamist (based on having spent an arbitrary amount of time in play). I want something in the setting, done by the PCs, to hang my hat on.

 

[KYRON45]

Advancing your PC for any reason other than actions that PC has accomplished, even as an abstraction, is either too narrative (based on the "story" you're telling) or too gamist (based on having spent an arbitrary amount of time in play). I want something in the setting, done by the PCs, to hang my hat on.

Can't a PC accomplish something both narratively and gamistly (i don't even know how to express that) that can be substantive?

 

[Guest 85555]

Well, as I noted in the original post, the term murderhobo is actually really recent! I know, shocking!

However, the idea of that type of play has long roots. In the 1970s, it was common to have shopkeepers "statted up" or to have them be, inter alia, polymorphed gold dragons in order to deter players from randomly killing shopkeepers and taking their stuff.

I think the first time I heard it was around 2010 or something. We used to call combat oriented campaigns hack N slash. I think now we tend to think of gaming groups as these platonic ideals of style (i.e. you have all heavy role players in a group, you have all tactical people, etc). That can happen, but mostly I think you have a mixture. There may be that guy who makes a no background killing machine but usually he is sitting next to the group thespian or strategist.

 

[Gradine]

Advancing your PC for any reason other than actions that PC has accomplished, even as an abstraction, is either too narrative (based on the "story" you're telling) or too gamist (based on having spent an arbitrary amount of time in play). I want something in the setting, done by the PCs, to hang my hat on.

I mean, the best uses of milestone leveling (ie, not just "we finished this chapter of AP, guess it's time to level). Curse of Strahd gives (admittedly limited) advice to this effect. Leveling is tied to major accomplishments, which certainly feels (imo) more tangible and less arbitrary than killing enough orcs to roll the counter up.