D&D 5E Ability Score Increases (I've changed my mind.)

[Bill Zebub]

This is fair and where we diverge I suppose. I like to have those flavorful but hyper-specific traits without necessarily needing them to be high use/impact. I’m happy enough to have the racial features provide more to out-of-combat role play and social interaction while leaving the combat features to class choice. And this is purely my personal response to each, but I find remembering a racial feature that I could be playing up with my PC to more often be an exciting reminder of RP potential whereas noticing I forgot a part of combat calculations after the fact more often frustrating or demoralizing. Perhaps it is the mathematics of the latter that causes me to feel that way.

Yes, I very much agree here. For elves, for example, it's super fun...and feels very elven...to be all, "Ha! No I DON'T fall asleep!" Even if it rarely happens.

Adding +1 to my bow attacks and damage doesn't feel very elven. I write it on the sheet and then largely forget about it.

 

[Scribe]

I don't know about 2-4, but #1 I disagree with. There's a reason why bad boys are popular. There's often just something about them that draws people. Charisma fits as much as anything else and more than some stats.

In 5e, the lore description goes to lengths to describe how they are marginalized and distrusted no?

To me that's a rightful -2 Cha mod, but I can at least see where you are coming from on the trope.

 

[Maxperson]

In 5e, the lore description goes to lengths to describe how they are marginalized and distrusted no?

That doesn't mean that there's not something about them that is undefinable and influential. Bad boys aren't really trusted, either. It's an odd dichotomy, but I can totally see a charisma bonus. This is especially true since the lore changed from "lower planar" to "devil." Devils are good at scamming and fooling people into making deals with them(charisma).

To me that's a rightful -2 Cha mod, but I can at least see where you are coming from on the trope.

 

[Bill Zebub]

In 5e, the lore description goes to lengths to describe how they are marginalized and distrusted no?

To me that's a rightful -2 Cha mod, but I can at least see where you are coming from on the trope.

It sounds to me like you're taking "Charisma" to mean "cultural biases", which could be a function of racial assumptions, physical features, or other things. And maybe D&D needs a formal mechanic to measure such biases, but it's not Charisma.

Your Charisma score is the same whether you are dealing with your own people, or your traditional enemies, so it's not how people react to what you look like. It's something intrinsic to you.

 

[Scribe]

It sounds to me like you're taking "Charisma" to mean "cultural biases", which could be a function of racial assumptions, physical features, or other things. And maybe D&D needs a formal mechanic to measure such biases, but it's not Charisma.

Your Charisma score is the same whether you are dealing with your own people, or your traditional enemies, so it's not how people react to what you look like. It's something intrinsic to you.

Yeah, I'm not a fan of the non physical attributes definition and use, so I get it.

Probably more a personal issue than anything else.

 

[abirdcall]

In 5e, the lore description goes to lengths to describe how they are marginalized and distrusted no?

To me that's a rightful -2 Cha mod, but I can at least see where you are coming from on the trope.

Charisma represents force of personality not necessarily how liked they are.

It gets a bit weird in cases like these with persuasion but it makes sense if you look at things like Warlock spellcasting and the few charisma saves.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

I mean it is kinda funny that of the three species that are described in PHB as mistrusted (drow, half-orc and tiefling) two get a charisma bonus, meaning that mechanically they actually are better than average at getting people to trust them!

 

[Bill Zebub]

I mean it is kinda funny that of three species that are described in PHB as mistrusted (drow, half-orc and tiefling) two get a charisma bonus, meaning that mechanically they actually are better than average at getting people to trust them!

How about this racial: when making a Charisma (persuasion or deception) roll, you may elect to roll with disadvantage. If you then succeed, any further attempts to persuade that target are made with advantage. The effect lasts until you fail such a roll.

(language obviously needs to be tweaked)

The "elect to roll with disadvantage" is meant to represent the unpredictability in reactions. It could have been "when interacting with somebody who has a bias against your culture, roll with disadvantage..." but that opens up a can of worms in terms of interpretation. I'd just let the player participate in the fiction by deciding when to use it.

 

[Scribe]

I mean it is kinda funny that of the three species that are described in PHB as mistrusted (drow, half-orc and tiefling) two get a charisma bonus, meaning that mechanically they actually are better than average at getting people to trust them!

Exactly, so either this is wrong, or I at least need to change how I view Charisma.

I don't like it that Warlocks are Charisma based either, but that's a whole other problem.

 

[Maxperson]

I mean it is kinda funny that of the three species that are described in PHB as mistrusted (drow, half-orc and tiefling) two get a charisma bonus, meaning that mechanically they actually are better than average at getting people to trust them!

Someone might persuade(cha) me to do something even though I don't trust them. Even someone untrustworthy can be very convincing(high charisma). Those two things are not the same.