Agile Shield Fighter and Two Weapon Fighting

[Bagpuss]

Ah but it's not that simple.

If you just play it like TWF gives no benifit then then you are forcing folks to take a pointless feat TWF if they want to shield bash more than once a turn effectively killing the Improved Two Weapon Fighting, Greater TWF tree, for someone that wants to bash away with his shield.

It being the Rules Forum I thought there might be some folks here that might have a more elegant solution than just sticking your head in the sand and pretending there isn't a problem.

It amazes me that people read a Rules Forum when they have no interest in discussing rules.

 

[Darklone]

All I want to hear is one rule: TWF cannot be used with shields.

Gimme that and I'm happy.

 

[Twowolves]

Considering that the off hand attacks are with a sub-par at best weapon (shield), that can't easily have weapon enhancements added, I don't see it's that bad. The two weapon fighter with a flaming burst keen off-handed weapon will still do more damage in the long run, wouldn't he?

 

[Bagpuss]

Perhaps but then he wouldn't have +3 to his AC (plus whatever magic the shield has) and be at -2 to hit, with his first attacks and -4 with his second compared to the shield fighter. And the Shield Fighter could always enchant the spikes to be keen flaming burst.

 

[MacMathan]

IMHO it was a feat that allowed a sword and boarder a shield bash without having to have a high dex.

A lot of S&B characters lean towards heavy armor where a high dex is wasted anyways.

I saw it as kind of like the feat, Armor specialization I think it was called, that allowed someone to get an AC bonus that couldn't qualify for Dodge dex-wise.

Personally IMC I would not allow them to stack.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Considering that the off hand attacks are with a sub-par at best weapon (shield), that can't easily have weapon enhancements added...

Er?

An enhancement bonus on a shield does not improve the effectiveness of a shield bash made with it, but the shield can be made into a magic weapon in its own right.

A +1 shield (1160gp, say) gets no bonus to attack or damage, but its shield bonus is improved. But a shield which is a +1 magic weapon (2310gp) might have its normal shield bonus, but it gets a +1 enhancement bonus to attack and damage rolls.

At the extreme end, you might have a +5 Heavy Fortification shield which is a +5 Flaming Burst Shocking Burst Ghost Touch weapon (300460gp).

Note that shield spikes aren't required to make a shield into a weapon, and if you add spikes to a shield, you get a spiked shield; you don't make +1 Flaming spikes on a shield, you make a +1 Flaming spiked shield. It's the shield or the spiked shield which is made into a magic weapon, not the spikes.

-Hyp.

 

[3d6]

Even better, buy a +1 bashing spiked heavy wooden shield. For 4157 gp, you get a +1 shield and a +1 one-handed weapon that deals 2d6 points of damage.

 

[Darklone]

Did I mention that I don't like shields?

 

[BASHMAN]

Agile Shield Fighter is a strange feat... I think it's only purpose is to allow shield fighters without high Dex to go shieldbashing TWF.

Yes, and it does not say you have to use a Light Shield. You can use your heavy steel shield, and it would have the same penalties as a buckler...

 

[BASHMAN]

All I want to hear is one rule: TWF cannot be used with shields.

Gimme that and I'm happy.

Sorry, but it can. A person who wants to fight with a shield in the offhand now has 2 paths before them:

take 2wf if you have a 15 dex, and take improved shield bash

OR

Take agile shield fighter, shield specialization, and improved shield bash. This way, you dont need a 15 dex. So it is more limited in that you need more feats and it is a more narrow effect, but easier to get into.

I will give you this-- they don't stack. That'd be dumb.