Animal Empathy opposed checks?

[Gruns]

Hey all...
More of a "How would you handle this situation" than a rules question...
I believe my new campaign(starting tonight) is going to have a Druid in it. (Players havent actually created characters yet, but have been throwing some ideas around.) Anyway, an early encounter I have planned involves a bear occupying a place the PCs need to go. The bear happens to be the pet of an ogre, who will not be present when the PCs first encounter the bear.
Now I assume the druid would try to Animal Empathy (or Wilderness Lore) the bear into at least a neutral state until the PCs do what they need to do. If this happens, and the ogre comes home to see the shenanigans going on, what are the chances the bear will turn on the PCs, should the ogre tell it to do so? Would you just have some sort of opposed Animal Empathy check? The ogre isn't a druid or anything, just had the bear for a while. On the other hand, the druid IS a druid, and this is what they do best so... I'm leaning toward giving the ogre a +2 to the roll, simply because it's more familiar with the bear. The bad side to this: This is my first time DMing with 2 of the 4 party members, and I just hope they have enough sense to have their 1st level characters run away if faced with the bear AND the ogre... Any thoughts from the vets?
Later!
Gruns

 

[Len]

If you want to do an opposed check to determine the bear's attitude, the druid's Wild Empathy would be opposed by the ogre's Charisma (because that's the stat for both Wild Empathy and Diplomacy).

But if the ogre is able to order the bear around, he must be using the Handle Animal skill. He has to have ranks in the skill in order to train the bear to attack on command. I'd say that the bear would attack unless the druid's Wild Empathy check was able to make the bear friendly (not just indifferent).

If the druid has Handle Animal, he could try to order the bear down or to attack the ogre. Since he didn't train the bear and doesn't know the specific commands the ogre taught it, I'd rule he has to "push" the bear rather than simply ordering it to attack - so now we have opposed Handle Animal checks with a penalty for the druid.

This is my first time DMing with 2 of the 4 party members, and I just hope they have enough sense to have their 1st level characters run away if faced with the bear AND the ogre.

You should tell the players up front that they will sometimes face enemies that they can't beat, and they should be ready to retreat, negotiate or go around. Because some people do assume they're supposed to fight everything. After warning them, if they get in over their heads it's up to them to get out of it.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

I agree that the mechanics of using Handle Animal on an unfamiliar animal requires Pushing.

I think we have to stop and consider the bear's POV. Presumably he is Friendly towards the ogre, and is unlikely to attack merely because he understands the Druid's command perfectly well.

I would allow the Druid a Wild Empathy vs. Ogre's Diplomacy to stop a command for the bear to attack the party.

BTW, this seems like a rather dangerous encounter for a 1st level party. Unless the bear helps them, there are likely to be dead PCs if fighting breaks out. A lucky Sleep or Color Spray may win the day for them, but sometimes that does not work out.