Anthony Valterra vs. Tracy Hickman

[Bendris Noulg]

Anyway, I assumed you were talking about me because you referred to the "blood and boobies" people, and I think I was the one who first used that term.

Yeah, it's becoming a bit of a catch-phrase 'round these parts (I'm even seeing it on other message boards, dagnabbit...).

Consequently, it's not so much being upset as it is frustration from having to repeat things too often... First these couple of people. Then the thread ends. But here comes another thread, with a couple of other people taughting the same line. Then the thread ends. Then comes another one...

Arrrrgggghhhh!!!!

Traumatic, sometimes. I think I'm over it though.

 

[William Ronald]

I suspect that there will be some debate between Anthony Valterra and Tracy Hickman, but it will be up to us to decide who won. (Assuming that Anthony Valterra is not pulling a joke on us all, and the WotC response is part of the joke. Read the press release closely. I wonder.)

Personally, I support the right of people to publish what they wish to do so. Mind you, I doubt I will have any real need for the book. While romance and sex exist in my campaign, I see no real need for rules. Sometimes, rules get in the way of enjoying a game.

I believe in a marketplace of ideas, and the right to counter ideas I disagree with. So, I will respect the right of someone to publish a given book, so long as no laws are broken. (There are some subjects I will not even broach on these boards.)

I think we need to cool the discussion a little. I think we can respect each other's rights to an opinion, and disagree or agree in a reasonable manner.

 

[Bendris Noulg]

http://ValarProject.com

 

[Lord Ravinous]

DocMoriartty:
Interesting comments.

I find it especially interesting that you mention the bible as family friendly.

Looking at both the Old and New Testamont I see stories of rape, murder, incest, and other henious acts so vile that it could make anyone sick.

If they were in a book labeled anything but the Bible I can see that most churchgoers would be all over the ban of such a vile book.

k....your saying (in a sense) that its hypocritical for the Bible to be considered "family-friendly" because both Testaments have instances of rape, murder, incest, etc...k, look up any instance of that and with a little reading you'll see that theirs a lesson behind each story. So for you to say that Rape, Murder, etc w/ a lesson attatched to the end is no different than a book depicting bondange, sex, etc. is (for lack of a nicer term) ignorant. You seem to want to just want to pick on the Bible because it's just that, the Bible. So do me a favor, and next time you wanna be cute, pick another topic.

And as for the publication of this book? Well, it's ultimatly up to the buyer, I personally don't like this sorta thing, but to each his own. But I do think it'll just add to the ANTI-D&D Sh*t list of stuff for ppl to b*tch about.

 

[Piratecat]

If this discussion veers into religion, it'll be shut down without warning. Don't go there, please.

 

[Aaron2]

First, to tell me that I shouldn't even want rules for something is to indicate that your tastes should dictate what is proper at my table. It is not for someone else to deside what material I should want or not want.

I'm not making my point clear. For me to walk into a game store and tell owner "I won't shop here if you continue to sell Product X" is in no way dictating what is proper at -your- gaming table, nor is it deciding what you should want.

Consider a second example. Near me there are two game stores. One, Gamechest is in a mall and is kid-friendly. They didn't stock BOVD. The other, GenX, has a huge rack of anime-teen-furry-adult comics. They are both equally far from where I work and I can only visit one in my lunch hour. I'll visit the kid-friendly store because adult-furry comics is not something I want to deal with after I just ate. I have, in effect, boycotted a store for selling product I don't like. This doesn't affect anyone's elses right to decide what and where to shop. The store owner has to decide if his adult-comic profits make up for the lack of game sales to me and others like me.

Shopping at a store that sells product X is, in a small way, supporting product X. What I'm trying to say in all this is that, while I am required to allow anyone the right to print Product X, I cannot be -required- to support it.

Second, there is nothing to indicate what this book will actually contain. The only sure indicator is the term "Erotic Fantasy", which can imply anything from orgasm rules to creating a campaign where sex isn't taboo (which is what Erotic Fantasy is generally known for). Yet, people are already happy to condemn it without any definate knowledge of what it contains or how it would be applied.

I'm not condemning it, I don't really care. I was just talking about a situation where I do care about some future Product X. This Erotic Fantasy book is definately third tier. It will come and go without much notice from anyone.

I just don't see the big demand.

Aaron

 

[herald]

Please don't close this thread. I believe that we have avoided for the most part of bringing beliefs into the thread.

Let's try and keep this on topic people.

 

[Lord Ravinous]

Pirate Cat:
If this discussion veers into religion, it'll be shut down without warning. Don't go there, please.

That's in no way my intent PC, but I'm offended by very little, but when ppl for no reason try to side-wall the Bible just to be cute, it pisses me off beyond belife. But I'll leave it alone, I just don't want you thinkin' I'm tryin' to start some crap w/ somebody.

 

[Lord Ravinous]

Oop, double post....

 

[Drakron]

...
And as for the publication of this book? Well, it's ultimatly up to the buyer, I personally don't like this sorta thing, but to each his own. But I do think it'll just add to the ANTI-D&D Sh*t list of stuff for ppl to b*tch about.

Let put this way ...

Anti-D&D groups will not compremise and will not end until D&D is no longer.

They dont play D&D and dont buy D&D products, they made their mind over what D&D is and what it does and they are not willing to talk about.

They are fanatics.

Also BovD was a "test market book" (true that White Wolf already had show there is a market for that type of books but WotC wanted to make sure it also existed in D&D and d20) and despite what Dragon preview indicated it was rather tame, but even after it got out there was still many people complaining about stuff that it was not even in the book.

So why sould WotC, Bastion Press and other d20 publishers sould care about anti-D&D groups, the very existence of D&D (and even other roleplaying games) is something they object and they dont buy books ... D&D players do.