Anyone seen the book of challenges...

[mmadsen]

I found the "about the author" blurb interesting:

About the Author
DANIEL KAUFMAN has written numerous articles for TopDeck magazine and has had Star Wars Roleplaying Game adventures published in Star Wars Gamer and on the Wizards of the Coast website. He lives in Washington state.

GWENDOLYN F. M. KESTREL recently contributed to both Magic of Faeren and Defenders of the Faith for the new edition of the Dungeons & Dragons game. She lives in Washington state.

MIKE SELINKER has designed dozens of products. Selinker's puzzles appear regularly in Games Magazine, the New York Times, and Dragon Magazine. He lives in Washington state.

SKIP WILLIAMS is a senior designer for the Wizards of the Coast roleplaying games division. His most recent credits include the latest edition of the D&D Monster Manual, and the D&D adventure Deep Horizon. He lives in Washington state.

 

[Wolfen Priest]

Based on the example they posted on the WotC website, I can tell pretty well that I would never use this book in my campaign. It seems to me like it's a book of puzzles, which is fine for some gamers.

Problem is, most players I play with don't play the game to solve IQ-test-like puzzles, but to roleplay, develop their characters, contribute to a storyline, and fight things. Traps &Treachery is a great product precisely because it fits into the theme of the game itself; traps were integral to D&D from the beginning.

I hat to say it (but it's no less true), but I think this product is indicative of WotC gradually losing more and more ground to the 3rd party publishers.

IMHO, the only 2 (okay 3) good products WptC has put out beyond the core 3 was the Manual of the Planes, Masters of the Wild, and possibly Tome & Blood. I never bought the FRCS, so I can't comment on that.

 

[Xeriar]

The book consists of a lot of neat ideas. Things you can extrapolate and build upon, perhaps, rather than use as merely solo additions to a quest - at least, that's how I would use it.

 

[Alaric_Prympax]

Problem is, most players I play with don't play the game to solve IQ-test-like puzzles, but to roleplay, develop their characters, contribute to a storyline, and fight things. Traps &Treachery is a great product precisely because it fits into the theme of the game itself; traps were integral to D&D from the beginning.

I had a different experience when I first started playing in the early 80's. I had a lot of puzzles thrown at me. Wasn't there a table called Tricks/Traps in the 1e DM's Guide? Traps were there but my early DM's also threw puzzles we had to figure out at us; it was just part of the game/adventure. Also a lot of riddles were put in the game. Infact that's how my first PC won his first magic sword. IIRC the 1e DM's Guide described a fountain that asked you a riddle/question- if you answered correctly you could drink from it and the water acted as if you drank a Healing Potion; if you answered incorrectly it spit acid (I think it was 1d8 pts of damage- it's been a long time since I looked at the book) and you had to Save vs Breath Weapon for half damage. For me puzzles along with traps were an integral part of D&D from my beginning with the game.

Oh well, we just had different experiences.

 

[Xarlen]

Hey, Grazzt, where you at, spesificly? I'm here in Chattanooga.

 

[Corinth]

My FLGS have it, but Amazon's late with shipping out my copy.

 

[DSC-EricPrice]

Originally posted by Wolfen Priest
Based on the example they posted on the WotC website, I can tell pretty well that I would never use this book in my campaign. It seems to me like it's a book of puzzles, which is fine for some gamers.

As a d20 publisher who became paranoid when this book suddenly appeared (I thought it might be too close in content to a project Im developing at the moment) I can say this book is more than just puzzles.

As sort of a "mini-review" I'll make a few comments. The book contains over 50 "challenges" for new and unique ways to stir up even the most experienced of gamers.

The puzzles range in EL from 1 to 22. They also give advice on how to scale them for different levels. In keeping with 3Es "return to the dungeon" theme most of them are designed for subterranean use, though some notables such as "Hill Giant Madness" do take place on the surface.

The encounters themselves often use monsters whose abilities radically alter the puzzle for would-be heroes. Perhaps my favorite of the entire book is "Pool of Endless Froglings" (though I wonder if its really EL3).

Many of the underlying principles of a challenge (such as the dreaded logic puzzle) are detailed explicitely so that DMs can create their own logic puzzles. In addition, there are a number of sidebars throughout the text that give DMs ideas on such topics as challenging high level characters, how to prepare for high level characters, and fighting in cramped spaces. My favorite however is the section on "Making a Deceitful Sales Pitch", which covers how to lie, cheat, and steal from your party while still putting a positive spin on it. lol

I'll admit there were a number of the challenges I downright hated but overall the book accomplishes what it set out to do - stir the devious imaginations of the DM. My freshly churned imagination will definitely be at work over the next few months as I work on some of Dragon Scale Counters' first adventure and sourcebook releases.

Hope that helps someone.

 

[mmadsen]

Based on the example they posted on the WotC website, I can tell pretty well that I would never use this book in my campaign. It seems to me like it's a book of puzzles, which is fine for some gamers.

They posted one example. That example was a puzzle. It turned me off a bit too, since I couldn't imagine an explanation for why such a puzzle would exist in a typical D&D world, but puzzles are a genre convention going way, way back (e.g. White Plume Mountain).

I'm assuming that example was the work of Mr. Selinker. "Selinker's puzzles appear regularly in Games Magazine, the New York Times, and Dragon Magazine." I wouldn't expect all the challenges to be logic puzzles.

 

[JoeGKushner]

My FLGS have it, but Amazon's late with shipping out my copy.

I feel your pain brother. Wait on.... wait on...

 

[Falcon]

I bought it last weekend, and like it. It gave me all kinds of ideas as a DM, and interesting examples to consider for higher level combat. I think the examples are generic enough to tweak however you want, and since they are presented per EL, it provides good examples of how to gauge EL levels, especially when incorporating things like heavy winds, gelatinous cube traps, etc. I think it was a good buy.