Archer Clerics

[Axel]

Hi guys 'n' girls. I've been lurking for awhile now and have finally been tempted to post. Why? I've seen a number of references by various people that claim that clerical archers (in 3.5 ed) are remarkably powerful.

Having been 'forced' (by bending my rubbery arms...) into taking Clerical levels with my (now character level 3) elven Warblade (with low str and con that was being massacred on the front line) to take Cleric levels due to a lack of well...actual Clerics in the party (not helping with the massacring) - I don't see it.

Racial proficiency with bow: good, but not intended.
Chosen domains: War & Travel (fits background of character). Good, but not really related to archery.
Spell selection: I don't get it. Most clerical spells (at low levels at least) relate to minor buffing. Higher level spells seem pointless as a bow might as well be shooting a door for all the effect it will have then.
Feat selection: Not currently related to archery, but if feats counted so much a fighter would be better.

So...can someone please enlighten me as to what makes a Cleric archer so (apparently) good?

 

[DumbPaladin]

I'm sure a much more experienced player will have some insights I don't, but I can think of a couple of useful things off the top of my head about YOUR archer cleric (there may be other more useful builds, but you are asking about your character specifically, I think):

-- You stay out of the fray. This can help you stay back and possibly heal other characters not on the frontline, move in and buff people as needed, and really otherwise use the battlefield to your advantage, all while doing damage.

-- Silence. Silence is a bard & cleric only spell. Cast silence on an arrow and shoot it at the evil caster as they're gesticulating. Your party wizard can't do that. Ta da!

-- Prayer & bless. Not only will these help you, but they'll help your party as well.

-- Travel domain. There's probably not a better domain for an archer to have in order to get away from people very quickly and position himself/herself in the best possible place to rain arrows down upon the party. Being able to fly eventually will be very helpful, too.

-- Align weapon. If you carry cold iron, silver, and adamantine arrows, you can pretty much guarantee you'll overcome damage reduction no matter what the combination, because you can make your arrows anarchic, axiomatic, good, or evil. Your party paladin can make his items good. No other caster can align weapons.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Part of it is the use of splat books. In fact, the build doesn't even work without the Zen Archery feat (use Wisdom instead of Dexterity to hit with ranged attacks). With that, Wisdom is now serving your spellcasting and attack modifier, and Dex becomes almost a dump stat (you still need 13+ for Rapid Shot). That means you can be an archer in full plate. It also means any spell that enlarges you (typically such spells raise strength and lower dex) are much more effective for you.

You need Zen Archery, Point Blank Shot (the Elf domain in Spell Compendium gives this for free), Precise Shot, and Rapid Shot. Many also like to be Cloistered Clerics for the free Knowledge domain (knowledges as class skills) and the skill points to use them, and then go for the Knowledge Devotion feat (C.Champion). With KD, you can roll a knowledge check* on creatures you face and get a bonus between +1 (automatic no matter how bad you roll) and +5 (requires check result of 36) to all attack and damage rolls against that creature type the rest of the encounter. Note you can also swap access to the Knowledge Domain to get KD immediately. I'd rather have the class skills and get it as a feat, though. (Also, a dirty trick is entering Church Inquisitor from C.Divine around level 4 since the requirements are easy. It gives you the Inquisition domain, which can also be traded for KD).

Cloistered Cleric saddles you with poor BAB. However...
1) Clerics Prestige class out anyway
2) You have spells to grant you full BAB
3) The Skillful weapon enhancement (+1 market price) in C.Arcane gives you medium BAB all the time if you need it, too.
4) Between buff spells, massive wisdom investment, Knowledge Devotion, etc... You really won't have a problem hitting

Some other minor tips for you:
-At low levels, and even higher maybe... The Blessed Aim spell (SpC) is awesome. 1st level and similar to Bless, except it only benefits ranged attacks and gives a +2 bonus.
-If you're going to be an Elf Cleric anyway, consider the Bow of the Wintermoon in Magic Item Compendium. It's very inexpensive and auto-adjusts to the user's strength. Handy since you benefit quite a lot from enlargement spells and your own spell list lets you buff str easily.

Hope that helped.

*C.Champion also happens to have Lore of the Gods spell at level 2. Lasts 10 min per level and gives a whopping +10 on all your knowledge checks if you worship a god with the Knowledge domain (+5 otherwise).

 

[Dandu]

Part of it is the use of splat books. In fact, the build doesn't even work without the Zen Archery feat

I'd dispute that, given the amount of buffs you can stack on yourself.

 

[Axel]

I'd dispute the use of Zen Archery too - at least in my character's case (Dex 18 vs Wis 14). I can see the attractiveness if you're building an archer Cleric from the ground up.

I have no intention of multiclassing further or taking Prestige classes - XP penalties are severe. If I avoid the XP penalties through level planning my character can easily end up less effective. Likewise the use of heavy armour is fairly counterproductive. I have a Dex of 18 already - elven chain or a mithral chain shirt provides the optimum combination of armour and dex bonuses. Mithral half plate is intrigueing though...

Prayer, bless, elation etc are all standard Cleric spell arsenal are they not? At least, I've not seen more than one Cleric in my group prepare for fighting encounters without them. Blessed aim is one I hadn't spotted before - thanks for that. I will probably be chased by the half-orc Barbarian for not casting Bless that particular combat, but hey - you've got to live a little.

Thanks for the tips re: Bow of the Wintermoon (don't have Magic Item Compendium, but will track it down), Silence, general tactics etc. It's all good advice. I'm slightly hamstrung by not building to be a Cleric from level 1 (i.e. Wis 14), but have some nifty bonuses in other places (Punishing Stance, Weapon feat swapping, Reflex save bonus). I have a certain childish level of glee anticipating getting Fly and raining arrows of doom on people...

 

[BENINHB]

Travel Devotion, also from complete champion, is a nice addition too. Move and full attack on the same turn can really boost your damage output and help minimize the damage you receive.

 

[Andion Isurand]

The Holy Warrior reserve feat (Complete Champion) is another good feat if you keep a war domain spell of at least 4th level uncast. Lets you add the spell level of the highest level war domain spell you have prepared and left uncast... to your weapon damage rolls.

 

[Khazan]

Having been 'forced' (by bending my rubbery arms...) into taking Clerical levels with my (now character level 3) elven Warblade (with low str and con that was being massacred on the front line) to take Cleric levels due to a lack of well...actual Clerics in the party (not helping with the massacring) - I don't see it.......

.......I'd dispute the use of Zen Archery too - at least in my character's case (Dex 18 vs Wis 14). I can see the attractiveness if you're building an archer Cleric from the ground up.......

....... Likewise the use of heavy armour is fairly counterproductive. I have a Dex of 18 already - elven chain or a mithral chain shirt provides the optimum combination of armour and dex bonuses. Mithral half plate is intrigueing though...

....... I'm slightly hamstrung by not building to be a Cleric from level 1 (i.e. Wis 14)....

Putting aside the suggestions others have made (all helpful as usual from the knowledgeable people here, I might add)... I have a question for you: if your group has "forced" you to make this change in your character, which wasn't part of your original plan for your character, and after seeing how a better Wisdom score could help make this transition, could you maybe petition your DM to allow you to swap your DEX and WIS scores?

After all, this was a change the group asked you to make, and you, being a super-nice cooperative helpful player ( ! ) have been trying to make this happen, but, your stats as originally generated were intended for a different path, so maybe the DM would see his way to letting you simply swap the 2 stats in question.

Worth a try maybe? It might make your life a little easier.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Travel Devotion, also from complete champion, is a nice addition too. Move and full attack on the same turn can really boost your damage output and help minimize the damage you receive.

Barring needing to get within 30 ft for precision based damage if you have some rogue, an archer REALLY doesn't need this...

 

[HoboGod]

And skirmish, don't forget skirmish. Mind you, skirmish and sneak attack aren't cleric abilities, but it's another of those advantages that make Cleric X/Scout 1 more appealing than Cleric 1/Scout X.