Are Rituals Vaporware?

[ProfessorCirno]

You know... thinking about it now, those all sound really vague.

Like, not in the "we don't want to talk about this yet" sense, but in the "yeah, here's some general ideas of what rituals are capable of, and that's all we're going to be giving you" sense.

Maybe I'm just reading too much into it.

I think that's what's driving the worry a lot of people have. Because so LITTLE has been really said about rituals, despite how much people have talked about it, people are starting to get a bit jaded over it. The more people praise something that hasn't been seen, the more suspicious others get.

 

[cdrcjsn]

I think that people are gonna be disappointed no matter what.

The book is only so many pages. How many pages can they devote to listing individual rituals? I mean, 8 classes with 30 levels worth of powers, magic items, tons of feats plus the rules for combat? There's not enough pages!

People will also be asking things like, "Why isn't this non-combat spell from PHB2, Spell Compendium or Races of the Dragon translated?"

What non-combat spells do you personally think are essential?

To me, it's a short list.
1) Divination/Scrying
2) a way to remove status effects (petrification, death, disease, energy drain)
3) Tenser's Floating Disk/Leomund's Chest, a way for my 8 Str Mage to carry heavy stuff
4) Phantom Steed/Shadowalk/Overland Flight, some long distance overland travel spell
5) Magic Item Creation to create useful portable magic
6) Static Magic Zone Creation, to enable magical areas to be created - basically everything from Hallucinatory Terrain to Magic Trap creation, etc. Stuff useful for an NPC to know.

If they cover the above and give guidelines on how to create more Rituals, I would be satisfied.

 

[Kvantum]

Does anybody else get the same feeling from 4e rituals that we did from the 3e announcements about Sorcerers? Like it's the last thing WotC will announce in order to A) keep hype high, and B) avoid disappointing people with an idea that while it sounds really cool in concept, will actually let everyone down somewhat in execution.

 

[Nytmare]

Because so LITTLE has been really said about rituals, despite how much people have talked about it, people are starting to get a bit jaded over it. The more people praise something that hasn't been seen, the more suspicious others get.

Hasn't this been true about every inch of 4th Edition so far? The rituals hullabahoo is nothing compared to skill encounters.

 

[Cirex]

Hasn't this been true about every inch of 4th Edition so far? The rituals hullabahoo is nothing compared to skill encounters.

Skill encounters are, skills, turned into frantic situations, with a similar feeling than combats and stuff.

Rituals are one of the newest thing that comes with the 4th and it's kinda "revolutionary", since it's going to work for many things that were just spells in 3.5. And it probably has many hidden surprises.

 

[muffin_of_chaos]

If you approve of the Vancian system, you probably aren't qualified to comment on the viability of 4E's unknown magical mechanics.

 

[ForbidenMaster]

Just as a base line, what we know:

However, toward the upper end of the [Heroic] tier, even death is a surmountable obstacle because of the Raise Dead ritual.

Rituals at the paragon tier begin to give characters magical ways to gather information and overcome obstacles. Divination rituals such as Consult Oracle grant access to knowledge they might otherwise not have, while View Object can make some kinds of mysteries obsolete. Exploration rituals such as Passwall and Shadow Walk let a party bypass solid barriers and quickly travel long distances.

At the epic tier, rituals include more and better kinds of divination, including the ability to spy on distant beings with Observe Creature. Epic characters can use True Portal to transport themselves instantly anywhere in the world.

You can spend this money on rituals....

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/4ex/20080416a

Rituals are obtained by buying ritual scrolls or ritual books. Ritual scrolls are consumed after one use, books teach the ritual to you permanantly. All rituals seem to have a casting time of at least 10 minutes, require a material component, and require the use of the ritual casting feat (which wizards and clerics get for free at 1st level) Most of the divination spells in 3.5 are now rituals as well as some of the old illusion spells.

http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=1022209

Anything else?

 

[The Little Raven]

Well, since vaporware is dependent on the product not appearing when it's supposed to be released, and 4e's release date is still a month away, it doesn't really qualify as vaporware. If June 6th comes and they're not in there, then Rituals are vaporware, but until that time they are simply a component that hasn't been previewed yet (and we've been guaranteed a preview on the 28th, so the only way it could be vaporware is if the preview says "HA! FOOLED YOU!").

 

[ProfessorCirno]

If you approve of the Vancian system, you probably aren't qualified to comment on the viability of 4E's unknown magical mechanics.

And why is this?

Don't bother answering, I already know you're just a troll.

 

[AZRogue]

Rituals seem to be the way DMs will control how much divination and crazy movement magic are allowed in his campaign. Since the DM controls which rituals are found, you just make sure which ones are available.

I don't see them as a cure to anything, other than some missing spells from a wizard's spellbook. I look at what we know of 4E and don't see anything broken that needs a ritual to fix. I think that 90% of what some people are hoping rituals will do are just either not there (many simulationist ideas, thankfully) or handled in a different, more gamist way that we've probably already seen.

To tell the truth, I think we've pretty much seen 4E already. We don't have specifics but we know how it works. I don't think there's much mystery left, other than in the details. We've seen the whole enchilada and it is good.