Are spellcasters more powerful?
- Thread starter LokiDR
- Start date
Simulacrum
First Post
Whats this spell WIELDSKILL?? it's not a core spell so most people are going not to include a spell that gives you huge boni on something the caster is good in anyway (who is the char with the biggest int?) If wieldskill is the spell that gives you +20 on rolls for just ANY skill, may I ask what level it is in?
-
Most arcane spellcasters are pathetic, especialy those who are focus on spellpower alone. They die like flies as soon something happens that isnt in their plan or covered by their spells. Usualy their saves are so bad that they drop by the first spell the cleric casts at them, that requires fortitude saves. It's hella difficult to balance out an arcane caster. while its super easy to make a VERY durable cleric and fighter type character (just take a level of monk, some feats etc just to make sure you succed at any save DC), who possess superior saves and LOTS of hitpoints, and still hitting hard enough to make the wizard think twice.
I usually make characters who have no save worse than 30+ when they reach level 20 (my best save was 39 in Fort), I'm buying all the cool feats that boost saves and collect all the items that do, its cool you shrug off 99% of all spells without even breaking a sweat!
-
Most arcane spellcasters are pathetic, especialy those who are focus on spellpower alone. They die like flies as soon something happens that isnt in their plan or covered by their spells. Usualy their saves are so bad that they drop by the first spell the cleric casts at them, that requires fortitude saves. It's hella difficult to balance out an arcane caster. while its super easy to make a VERY durable cleric and fighter type character (just take a level of monk, some feats etc just to make sure you succed at any save DC), who possess superior saves and LOTS of hitpoints, and still hitting hard enough to make the wizard think twice.
I usually make characters who have no save worse than 30+ when they reach level 20 (my best save was 39 in Fort), I'm buying all the cool feats that boost saves and collect all the items that do, its cool you shrug off 99% of all spells without even breaking a sweat!
Bauglir said:
The truth is, Clerics are overpowered, and the most unbalanced class in the PHB, and this was done intentionally. Y'see, while Clerics are almost absolutely necessary, most folks don't wanna play'em! Hence the overbalancing. That, and necessity, pretty much asure that someone will play one.
Chacal
First Post
Steverooo said:
The truth is, Clerics are overpowered, and the most unbalanced class in the PHB, and this was done intentionally. Y'see, while Clerics are almost absolutely necessary, most folks don't wanna play'em! Hence the overbalancing. That, and necessity, pretty much asure that someone will play one.
We used to play lots of priests in 2ed, and not the powerful ones with lots of bonus on top of the cleric class.
We played the ones with D6 HD , no full armor, no access to healing, no turn undead.
We liked the flavor of these classes. What a bunch of wierdos we were !
Chacal
MarauderX
Explorer
True, but if a wizard is not prepared a day ahead of time he won't be ready to deal with certain situations. Sorcerer PCs just tend to focus on damage spells first and aiding spells second, making them rather worthless for versitility like a wizard can be. Then as a wizard you have to be very accurate at what you will need to study for the day.
If you have continued battling or plenty of encounters in a day there is usually the case where you don't have the spell you need memorized or available, and it can become dangerous and frustrating if a DM keeps exploiting it to teach you to take other spells besides lightning bolt. Then of course when you do and expect a peaceful day of R&R, you get jumped by something that the party should be able to beat down but ends up getting stretched to their limits.
Meanwhile fighters and the like are always ready to go. No prep time, no need to make predictions about tools when entering a dungeon, just do it.
I just think if you threw an arcane caster and a fighter of equal levels into an arena, the fighter may take a beating but will prevail ~75% of the time.
Wieldskill: cleric 1. fairly long duration. +10 to one skill check in the skill chosen at casting time. Any skill.Simulacrum said:
You are the exception. Clerics have 2 good saves. Wizards have empowered stat buff spells and Protection from Spells. Most monsters have relatively low save DCs. Polymorph and stat buff stack. I rarely have a problem with save as either type of caster.Simulacrum said:
You have seen inept sorcerers, and most probably wizards. With persistant spell, you cast once in the morning. At 10th level, an extended stat buff spell lasts 20 hours, a small margin to worry about for surprise attack. Ditto GMW. Wands give you extra bang when you memorized spells run low. Ditto scrolls.MarauderX said:
A decent player will never be caught unprepared, partially due to long term stat-buffs. If the fighter is in the middle of R&R, they don't have armor or weapon. The wizard only needs his mind and a pouch of materials.MarauderX said:
At 9th+ level, wizards have teleport. How do you keep them from running away? Also, with the defensive spells that casters have, they can easily have higher AC than non-casters. The reason the fighters keep going is the clerics healing them, which only shifts the burden.
And many, many less options.MarauderX said:
I have done the experiment many times. The clerics (especially Lirians) and other casters almost always win.MarauderX said:
WattsHumphrey
First Post
LokiDR said:
He||s yeah! Let's hear it for Llirans!!!
LLIRA! LLIRA!
*snicker*
Re
Personally, my experience is that divine casters infringe more often on a fighters turf than an arcane casters turf. Clerics can often buff themselves up so well that they are both more durable and more powerful than a similar leveled melee over the course of a combat.
Arcane casters have spells that clerics simply don't have and will never have. They can simulate other spells more easily as well. For example, whenever I go up against a cleric, I use Limited Wish or Spell Turning to deal with their death spells. Then proceed to do spell battle with them usually from the air.
A well-played arcane caster can often beat a high level cleric unless its as stupid as who wins initiative and gets the death spell off. Then again, it pays to have magic items that protect against death effects, the clerics most dangerous weapon. I almost always have contingencies for surprise attacks and wear an item that provides me with a high degree of protection.
I don't do battle with people while alone and suprised. I port away, then find out who is attacking me using divination spells. I can better prepare myself for dealing with that person in the future.
The big problem is most people don't know how to play arcane casters. That is why they may seem weaker than they actually are at times.
Personally, my experience is that divine casters infringe more often on a fighters turf than an arcane casters turf. Clerics can often buff themselves up so well that they are both more durable and more powerful than a similar leveled melee over the course of a combat.
Arcane casters have spells that clerics simply don't have and will never have. They can simulate other spells more easily as well. For example, whenever I go up against a cleric, I use Limited Wish or Spell Turning to deal with their death spells. Then proceed to do spell battle with them usually from the air.
A well-played arcane caster can often beat a high level cleric unless its as stupid as who wins initiative and gets the death spell off. Then again, it pays to have magic items that protect against death effects, the clerics most dangerous weapon. I almost always have contingencies for surprise attacks and wear an item that provides me with a high degree of protection.
I don't do battle with people while alone and suprised. I port away, then find out who is attacking me using divination spells. I can better prepare myself for dealing with that person in the future.
The big problem is most people don't know how to play arcane casters. That is why they may seem weaker than they actually are at times.
Similar Threads
