D&D 5E Artificers, Paladins, and Rangers, oh, MY! (Concerning Cantrips)

[DND_Reborn]

Since we started playing 5E about 4 years ago, we have always house-ruled that Paladins got cantrips equal to Clerics of equal level and Rangers got cantrips equal to Druids of equal level.

Never a fan of Artificers, who are (in many ways) the "arcane" half-caster, I did notice in looking at their class table in TCoE that they receive both cantrips and spellcasting at level 1, despite being obvious half-casters.

So, will Paladins and Rangers ever see the same?

Personally, I like the idea of half-casting classes gaining cantrips at level 1, but no 1st-level spells until level 2. This is what we do for Paladins and Rangers, as I mentioned above, and since Bards became our "arcane" half-caster, it is what they get as well.

 

[Stormonu]

I think there’s a fighting style for Paladin and Ranger in Tasha’s that gives cantrips.

I’ve often bemoaned the half casters not getting cantrips, alas, in those cases I wasn’t the DM. I’d happily do it if I were DMing. Green Flame blade paladin? Yes, please.

 

[DND_Reborn]

I think there’s a fighting style for Paladin and Ranger in Tasha’s that gives cantrips.

Yes, there is, but even if it gives them cantrips, IIRC they never gain any more. As where normal spell progression grants additional cantrips at higher levels.

And, frankly, I would hate for those classes to sacrifice one of their key lower level features for something Artificers get for free...

 

[ECMO3]

Yes, there is, but even if it gives them cantrips, IIRC they never gain any more. As where normal spell progression grants additional cantrips at higher levels.

And, frankly, I would hate for those classes to sacrifice one of their key lower level features for something Artificers get for free...

I think the fighting style is the right way to do it and they get a lot Artificers don't get including martial weapons, extra attack and other abilities which can be pretty powerful. You can switch them out too, so you don't have to keep the same ones. Usually I get the Druidic Warrior Fighting Style on most Rangers I play. I don't play Paladins that much, and probably would not get the cantrip fighting style with them because the Cleric Cantrips are not as good/necessary.

Not to say Artificers dont get their own stuff, but Rangers with a good subclass are arguably the most powerful half caster in the game and Paladins are not far behind.

 

[DND_Reborn]

I think the fighting style is the right way to do it and they get a lot Artificers don't get including martial weapons, extra attack and other abilities which can be pretty powerful. You can switch them out too, so you don't have to keep the same ones. Usually I get the Druidic Warrior Fighting Style on most Rangers I play. I don't play Paladins that much, and probably would not get the cantrip fighting style with them because the Cleric Cantrips are not as good/necessary.

Not to say Artificers dont get their own stuff, but Rangers with a good subclass are arguably the most powerful half caster in the game and Paladins are not far behind.

I could understand this if two things happened:

1. Paladins and Rangers got their fighting style at 1st level, allowing them to learn cantrips at the same point Artificers do, and
2. They gained additional cantrips at 10th and 14th levels (as they gave Artificers).

But, personally, I'll just stick to our house-rule.

Still, it will be interesting to see if things get updated for these classes in the next few years...

 

[EzekielRaiden]

I personally very much prefer Paladins and Rangers to not actually be spellcasters at all, and instead use other forms of supernatural power to achieve their ends. E.g. Paladins having Litanies (ritual/aura effects) and Decrees (stuff that targets specific things). I haven't thought as much about the Ranger side of things, but I've no doubt there are things one could use.

But no, I don't really expect cantrips to get officially baked into either class. Spells are supplementary to their identity, not core, whereas spells are core to the Artificer's identity, not supplementary. The fighting style solution is IMO inelegant, but it gets the job done.

 

[DND_Reborn]

I personally very much prefer Paladins and Rangers to not actually be spellcasters at all, and instead use other forms of supernatural power to achieve their ends.

I would be all for this line as well, if spellcasting was removed entirely... but as it is part of the current classes, it just seems odd to me that cantrips are not part of these half-casters by default.

 

[Helldritch]

The artificer receives cantrips because it will never get as much attacks as a ranger or a paladin and most of its spells are on the utility side. Paladins got smites and rangers got hunter's mark to boost their damage. Thw artificer needed something and cantrips were an easy solution.

I don't think that adding cantrips to paladins and rangers is a bad idea, but it is not a good idea either. Unless these cantrips are more of a utility nature, an attack cantrip... well, a paladin and ranger lack the ability of an eldritch knight to make an additional attack on casting a spell so it limits them to one and only one attack. Is it really worth it?

 

[cbwjm]

Cantrips do add a lot to the flavour of the paladin and ranger. My biggest gripe with half-casters is that now we have two separate versions, the artificer and the others. I much prefer the artificer version with spells at 1st level and that's what I use for my arcknight and enhancement shaman subclass.

I guess I understand why paladins and rangers don't gain cantrips or spells at 1st level while the artificer does, the first 2 are meant to be focus on martial combat while the last is focused more on magic, but still, it irks me a little. Paladin and ranger have been getting spells earlier as the editions have moved on, so who knows what the future will bring.

 

[DND_Reborn]

but still, it irks me a little.

It is a minor issue, isn't it, but still annoying LOL!

1st Level flies by so fast, I wouldn't even mind them getting cantrips at 2nd level but not at the expense of their fighting style...