D&D 5E ASCENSION, The Codex of Exalted, Book 1: Players Guide

[Stalker0]

I did my first general read through. I like the action economy; it’s a strong statement that an ascended character is just flat out badass. It reminds me of the last clash of the titans movie where the gods came down and were moving so quick the mortals were standing still. It pairs well with your “normalizing rules”, to keep combat simple even if flavor wise the battle could be over in seconds considering how fast everything is moving.

I was not a fan of getting an extra d20 per rank. That gets clunky at 3 rolls and especially 4, and it’s hard to work with disadvantage especially. Lastly more dice start to have less and less benefit.

I would rather just something like “gain a bonus to all d20 rolls equal to your divine rank”, if there was any place where we could break 5e bounded accuracy I think it’s the deities.

exalted proficiency could use a cleanup. So I have expertise…but not proficiency. I have a bonus…but I use my talent score. So is it my talent score plus expertise? It’s just not clear here

 

[Rogerd1]

Okay so this needs saying, the Immortal Ascension books for 3e, were baaaaaaad. Like terribad, please do not emulate them.

Secondly, there is already a 5e attempt at Mystara Immortals for 5e, that is not very good either. Take the good parts, but discard the rest.

Now the thing is that using Spheres, essentially Mage, but have also been imported from PF1e into 5e in Spheres of Power. So it is possible for mortals to now wield spheres too.

 

[The Glen]

Problem with the Immortals boxed set was it was pretty much an entirely different game. Too many new concepts and all the mechanics had few connections with the BECM part of the rules.

 

[dave2008]

I did my first general read through. I like the action economy; it’s a strong statement that an ascended character is just flat out badass. It reminds me of the last clash of the titans movie where the gods came down and were moving so quick the mortals were standing still. It pairs well with your “normalizing rules”, to keep combat simple even if flavor wise the battle could be over in seconds considering how fast everything is moving.

Thanks! I always appreciate your comments.

I was not a fan of getting an extra d20 per rank. That gets clunky at 3 rolls and especially 4, and it’s hard to work with disadvantage especially. Lastly more dice start to have less and less benefit.

I may offer an optional rule to do just that. However, I liked the idea that as exalted get higher ranks, luck becomes less and less part of the equation. Also, I don't recall if this is in the current post, but this can be normalize as well. So if all the foes are of the same rank, you don't apply exalted advantage.

exalted proficiency could use a cleanup. So I have expertise…but not proficiency. I have a bonus…but I use my talent score. So is it my talent score plus expertise? It’s just not clear here

Hmmm. I may have to look through this again before I move into the next sections. Exalted proficiency was supposed to be completely changed, or perhaps I need to clarify my intent. Basically exalted just use their full talent score when they make checks. No proficiency or expertise really. Though I do remember I had something about adding your exalted rank as a type of expertise. I need to get back into my notes!

 

[dave2008]

Okay so this needs saying, the Immortal Ascension books for 3e, were baaaaaaad. Like terribad, please do not emulate them.

I disagree. I think there was a lot of interesting things in there. Much more interesting than the official epic level handbook / deities and demigods for 3e. However, there was also a lot of craziness that I don't wish to replicate.

Secondly, there is already a 5e attempt at Mystara Immortals for 5e, that is not very good either.

yes, I have that too.

Take the good parts, but discard the rest.

That is my approach to pretty much everything I do.

Now the thing is that using Spheres, essentially Mage, but have also been imported from PF1e into 5e in Spheres of Power. So it is possible for mortals to now wield spheres too.

I have the 5e spheres of books (the name for the martial one escapes me), but I am not sure what your trying to say. The "spheres" concept from BECMI is not the same as the "Spheres of Power" for PF or 5e. Also, I don't use the term "Spheres" here. I have replaced / revised the idea and I call them "Authorities." And mortals definitely cannot use Authority (in fact most exalted can't either).

 

[Rogerd1]

I disagree. I think there was a lot of interesting things in there. Much more interesting than the official epic level handbook / deities and demigods for 3e. However, there was also a lot of craziness that I don't wish to replicate.

yes, I have that too.

That is my approach to pretty much everything I do.

I have the 5e spheres of books (the name for the martial one escapes me), but I am not sure what your trying to say. The "spheres" concept from BECMI is not the same as the "Spheres of Power" for PF or 5e. Also, I don't use the term "Spheres" here. I have replaced / revised the idea and I call them "Authorities." And mortals definitely cannot use Authority (in fact most exalted can't either).

And even in taking the good parts, you need to be very, very careful that you don't let the power level creep in, as there comes a point where no edition of DnD can cater to those power levels. At that point you require Champions, or better yet M&M 2e / 3e. As those are the games required to run that level of game, they just are.

Spheres of Power Wiki Home Page - Spheres of Power Wiki

Spheres of Power is an original magic system created by Drop Dead Studios for use with the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game.

spheresofpower.wikidot.com

Whether you call them Authorities, or Spheres, it is just a naming convention for what are essentially the same things.

The thing is, we have 3e Deities books for guidelines into gods (it was overpowered and worked better with M&M). My advise would be move away from gods - and think more Stargate Ascension, or the rpg Eternity (it's free) where you play incorporeal godlike beings that can essentially create their own realms, servants etc.

They might even have their own realm, which is more akin to a mathematical construct where they can observe all of reality without bodies.

Then you can concentrate on how they actually get to that stage. Is more akin to Mage the Ascension, or Mage the Awakening? Or something else entirely?

Forget what has gone before. Forge your own path.

Where did you find that awesome picture by the way?

 

[Rogerd1]

Okay so let's look at this another way.
DnD 4e had some great things in it, one of which were Paragon paths. So perhaps there are a variety of paths available - PF1e had a lot of mythic paths.

So let's say that being a godling, or Empyrean, like in the Monster Manual - and Arkadia, is another route.

Ascension, could be another path, as you go the initial route of being partially ascended, just like in Stargate; until you become fully incorporeal, and then ascended. You could also incorporate stuff from Mage too.

 

[dave2008]

And even in taking the good parts, you need to be very, very careful that you don't let the power level creep in, as there comes a point where no edition of DnD can cater to those power levels. At that point you require Champions, or better yet M&M 2e / 3e. As those are the games required to run that level of game, they just are.

I'm really stretching the idea that this is "5e" the further along I go. It is really something I am not worried about. There will definitely be power level creep, that is kinda the point.

Spheres of Power Wiki Home Page - Spheres of Power Wiki

Spheres of Power is an original magic system created by Drop Dead Studios for use with the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game.

spheresofpower.wikidot.com

Whether you call them Authorities, or Spheres, it is just a naming convention for what are essentially the same things.

I disagree with you their. The "Spheres" in BECMI really have nothing in common with "Spheres of Power." Perhaps you didn't play the "I" in BECMI, but the "Spheres" had very little mechanical footprint (and even less so with the later revisions). I have renamed them Authorities because I am taking the original concept and expanding / changing it a bit. I think there will be some similarities with both the original "Spheres" and "Spheres of Power," but there are significant differences too. The current concept of Authority is both a path and a power, but I am still working on the details. However, it is something like:

• Like a class that you progress through and get certain authority features as you level up.
• It is an "easy" button. You can use your authority to do basically anything within your range. But you can only do this a set number of times - ever. If a player uses its authority, the DM should simple say: OK, that is what happens (with some boundaries with respect to other exalted and your Authority). The player basically takes "authority" from the DM when they do this
• Using authority, similar to power combat in BECMI, happens outside of the initiative order and is always adjudicated first

The thing is, we have 3e Deities books for guidelines into gods (it was overpowered and worked better with M&M). My advise would be move away from gods - and think more Stargate Ascension, or the rpg Eternity (it's free) where you play incorporeal godlike beings that can essentially create their own realms, servants etc.

What a god is or isn't is not strictly defined IRL. They can be anything from the omnipotent Christian "God" to the intelligent spirit beast from Princess Mononoke. So there is no need to move away from "gods," it is just how do you want to define them. For Ascension, they are somewhere in between. Starting out as something similar to power spirit beasts and ending up something closer to omnipotence.

Forget what has gone before. Forge your own path.

In reality that is what I am doing. I am pretty sure the "5e" tag I originally put on this thread will not be accurate when it is all done.

Where did you find that awesome picture by the way?

Which picture? I originally started this project as a Kickstarter and commissioned a good bit of art. So some of the art in this thread unique that I commissioned or created myself.

 

[dave2008]

Okay so let's look at this another way.
DnD 4e had some great things in it, one of which were Paragon paths. So perhaps there are a variety of paths available - PF1e had a lot of mythic paths.

So let's say that being a godling, or Empyrean, like in the Monster Manual - and Arkadia, is another route.

Ascension, could be another path, as you go the initial route of being partially ascended, just like in Stargate; until you become fully incorporeal, and then ascended. You could also incorporate stuff from Mage too.

There are two types of gods in Ascension: original gods and mortal creatures who achieve apotheosis. Players are of the later type by default. Regardless of the method, gods of all ranks have access to mortal, incorporeal, and true forms. The game primarily deals with true forms as they are the most powerful and functional.

PS - thank you for the conversation and your ideas about deities and exalted. I enjoy it!

 

[dave2008]

Problem with the Immortals boxed set was it was pretty much an entirely different game. Too many new concepts and all the mechanics had few connections with the BECM part of the rules.

Yes and no. Personally, that is what I want in immortal level play. It should, IMO, have fundamental differences to how it is played. It should not feel like the same game to me. That is what drew me to the Immortals set more than anything.

For Ascension I have worried about how much I should hold over from 5e and gone back and forth on mechanics. Recently I decided not to worry about how much it looks like or plays like 5e and just make the game I want.