Assigning LA?

[Kemrain]

I'm making a template for a character of mine in the d20 Fantasy game I'm playing in, and since we use DnD as the basis for the rules, I was wondering if you all could help me figure out where WotC put the rules for determining what a template's LA is.

I've heard that there was some sort of equivalency equation, and that it was in Savage Species, but I looked and couldn't find it, and SS is a 3.0 book, and we're running with 3.5 rules anyways.

Hell, while I'm at it...

If I wanted to throw together a template that gave +2 to Strength, Dex and Charisma, DR 5/Good, Energy Resistance 5 Fire, Electricity, and Acid, +5 Racial Bonus to Fort Saves vs. Poison, Charm Person, Suggestion, Alter Self, and Detect Good as spell-like abilities, (Charisma based DC's) at will, a Fly speed of 50, Darkvision 60', a +2 Racial Bonus to Spot and Listen (and +10 to Disguise from Alter Self), and Speak Language as a permanant class skill, what kind of LA should be assigned?

Thanks in advance.

- Kemrain the Half-Fiendish, Celestial, Feral, Insectile, Gelatenous, Psudonatrual, Whight Radish Demi Dragon.

-Edit: I goofed and said EL instead of LA. Stupid me. Been corrected. Move along. There's nothing to see here.. Please don't laugh at me...

 

[Thanee]

I can only guess... +4?

Bye
Thanee

 

[Conaill]

I assume you mean LA, or Level Adjustment. EL is Encounter Level, which has anything to do with this topic. I would suggest you change the thread title if you want to get any meaningful responses.

Savage Species may be "old", but it's still the standard when it comes to assigning Level Adjustment. It came out right before 3.5, and was intended to be 3.5 compatible.

Thanee's +4 LA may be somewhat generous. With that many special bilities, it could easily be higher.

 

[shilsen]

Thanee's +4 LA may be somewhat generous. With that many special bilities, it could easily be higher.

Compare Kemrain's template to a half-celestial or half-fiend. Both of them are as strong as the one he described, if not stronger, and they have a +4 LA. So if he's going to keep it balanced with core stuff +4 sounds good to me.

 

[Kemrain]

I assume you mean LA, or Level Adjustment. EL is Encounter Level, which has anything to do with this topic. I would suggest you change the thread title if you want to get any meaningful responses.

Savage Species may be "old", but it's still the standard when it comes to assigning Level Adjustment. It came out right before 3.5, and was intended to be 3.5 compatible.

Thanee's +4 LA may be somewhat generous. With that many special bilities, it could easily be higher.

I feel sharp as a brick.. Oh well, title changed! And at least I made a mistake that is common. Nearly everyone has screwed up with that, or, at least, tons of people. We can't all be Hypersmurf.

The template does compare to the Half Fiend, but I was hoping to find a chart that said something like "Stat mod of +6 to +10 is X points" and "Add points together, Devide by Y, square by Pi r, do the hokey pokey, and you have your LA."

Though the Half-Fiend is comparable to this Template, this one doesn't scale with level the way that the Half-Fiend does. I want to know what X and Y is worth, so I can argue it to my GM and minmax a little, get the most bang for my buck, and still create something fair for everyone else to play with. It's the kinda thing I like to do.

- Kemrain the Embarrassed.

 

[Conaill]

I feel sharp as a brick.. Oh well, title changed! And at least I made a mistake that is common. Nearly everyone has screwed up with that, or, at least, tons of people. We can't all be Hypersmurf.

No problem. I'm just trying to make sure the right people get to see your thread.

The template does compare to the Half Fiend, but I was hoping to find a chart that said something like "Stat mod of +6 to +10 is X points" and "Add points together, Devide by Y, square by Pi r, do the hokey pokey, and you have your LA."

Wel, that is what Savage Species does... sorta. The SS guidelines seriously overstimate LA, but you're supposed to do an "acid test" by comparing with a normal character with class levels.

If you want to go by the SS guidelines, here's what it would look like:

+2 to Strength, Dex and Charisma: +1 LA
DR 5/Good: +1 LA
Energy Resistances: +1 LA
spell-like abilities at will: at least +1 LA
Fly speed of 50: +1 or +2 LA (depending on maneuverability)
Darkvision 60', Racial Bonus to Fort Saves vs. Poison: +1 LA?
skill bonuses: +1 LA

Total : +7 LA

Obviously, this is a ridiculously high over-estimation - which you would presumably realize once you do the acid test compared to, say, a Sor7.

An alternative approach would be to use something like Soldarin's ECL Calculator. This is a fan-based utility which was developed to estimate ECL's for 3.0, when the published ECL's where still very much in flux. There's no guarantee that it will work correctly for 3.5, but it might give a reasonable lower bound.

Compare Kemrain's template to a half-celestial or half-fiend. Both of them are as strong as the one he described, if not stronger, and they have a +4 LA. So if he's going to keep it balanced with core stuff +4 sounds good to me.

Yup, you're right. One could argue that the Half-fiend LA seems too low, but that's a discussion for another day. Except for the very strong spell-like abilities, Kemrain's template seems weaker in almost all respects, so +4 LA seems like it might be a reasonable upper bound. With thinkgs like Suggestion at will, I don't think you'll find anyone to argue that it should be lower than that though...


If the point is to persuade your DM, you may do better by taking an existing template and swapping out some abilities in a balanced way. For example, you could start out with the Half-Fiend template, and swap Darkness 3/day for Detect Good at will, then swap Str 2, Dex +2 and Con +2 for Alter Self at will and you're getting close to your target... You'll just be a variant half-fiend, which may be a lot more palatable than a home-brewn template to your DM.