AU - first impressions?

[Derulbaskul]

First impressions?

Love it. Looks great. Desperately want Diamond Throne.

Cheers
D

PS: Sam Wood's art was great. Some of the other pieces, though, reminded of the really bad stuff from the first Creature Collection. Ugh.

 

[Geoffrey]

It is more helpful to UNlearn the D&D conventions while dealing with AU; understand that many D&D conventional thoughts (Alignments, known spells, spell components, etc.) are quite different, or removed entirely. It's almost better to assume it's balanced, play a few games, and go from there.

It sounds like I will have an advantage, then. I've never played 3.0 or 3.5 D&D, nor have I purchased any of the books. I have ordered AU from Amazon. Maybe AU will be clearer to me than to most since I won't be looking at it through D&D goggles.

 

[Merlion]

Well I shall at last be getting my copy today, so once I've absorbed, I'll give my impressions
Although I can tell you its almost certainly going to be mostly good ones ::

 

[Malacoda]

You're kidding, right?

No

It says in every Spells section, the word any. Can prepare any (complex, simple, whatever) spell. How much more clear can it be.

Leaps and bounds, I would say.

How about this...

Page 164, column two, paragraph three:

"Casters learn the spells they have access to by reading books, studying scrolls, and from studying under others. This study is assumed to have happended to have occurred before the campaign, or during campaign down time."

What if I have no downtime? What if a character gains access to a spell level while slogging through a dungeon, having spent no real time studying, or anything resembling downtime except for sleeping and short resting? Does he have access to all those new spells for his level? The rules tells use they learn spells, not gain them automatically, like clerics. So what happens when you don't get a chance to learn them?

Should it say, "He can prepare any simple spell. No, really. Honest. Any one. I mean it. I promise. Any simple spell."?

As amusing as that would be, I will settle for knowing if he means any spell in the game, any spell on the list or any spell they know, since there does seem to be a distinction.

I think that Malhavoc shot itself in the foot (or at least dropped a heavy rock on its foot) by trying so much to argue that it's perfectly compatable with 3E. That said, it's not overly generous in context with everything else. If everyone is getting that ability, it doesn't matter if you do too.

I would certainly not argue that it is overly generous within its own context. I might be, but I haven't read enough to tell.

I'll be sure to lobby hard for them to include this sort of clarity in the next edition of the book. Because what they have in there, man, it's way too vague.

Not really interested in a discussion, are you?

 

[Shard O'Glase]

???

You're kidding, right? It says in every Spells section, the word any. Can prepare any (complex, simple, whatever) spell. How much more clear can it be. Should it say, "He can prepare any simple spell. No, really. Honest. Any one. I mean it. I promise. Any simple spell."?

No but it should of said something like. Can prepare any X spell, upon gaining a new spell level they have access and know all X spells learning them is considered aprt of the process of gainng the new level.

Considering it is D20, and people will be coming from D&D to not write the above basicaly means a lot of people will spend time looking for the passage that describes how people learn spells.

 

[RobNJ]

Considering it is D20, and people will be coming from D&D to not write the above basicaly means a lot of people will spend time looking for the passage that describes how people learn spells.

It is patently unreasonable to expect an author to predict the reading comprehension levels and biases of everyone who might buy their book. Monte clearly intended AU to stand on its own, and if you read it as its own book, rather than comparing it to D&D, you'll see that everything is very clear.

My frustration at this is that people didn't read clearly, and are blaming it on the writer, who wrote a very clear sentence (several of them, in fact). Instead of just saying "oops", the reader is demanding that the writer predict the ways in which he might misinterpret what he's reading. That's far too great a burden to put on anyone, because (and I know this from professional experience) the ways in which people can misinterpret a simple and straightforward sentence are myriad and unfathomable.

Why can't people just say, "Oops, my bad, there it is."?

 

[BiggusGeekus@Work]

I've been looking to bring in some of the AU classes (particularly Mage Blade) into my FR campaign. What spell list do you use for Mage Blades, and do they seem balanced compared to the D&D classes?

As for balanced compared to D&D, I'd have to give a bit of pause.

All the AU classes have a 10% experience penalty to level gain compared to D&D classes. So your Mage Blade is going to be gaining levels slower than a fighter/sorceror.

But ultimately, I don't think that AU is perfectly balanced with D&D. This isn't a bad thing. I mean, Broncausaurus Rex isn't prefectly balanced with D&D and no one thought to complain. But you can't casually drop an AU class into an existing D&D game and call it a day. Which is a darn shame because the AU classes are REALLY FREAKING COOL!

 

[Apok]

What if I have no downtime? What if a character gains access to a spell level while slogging through a dungeon, having spent no real time studying, or anything resembling downtime except for sleeping and short resting? Does he have access to all those new spells for his level? The rules tells use they learn spells, not gain them automatically, like clerics. So what happens when you don't get a chance to learn them?

Then I would guess the character in question wouldn't gain access to his new level of spells until he's had some downtime and a chance to study.

Exactly what does studying entail?

Player: Ok, now that we're through and have some time off, I'm going to expand my spell repetoir by learning from other spellcasters, reading tomes of ancient lore, and attending that "Better Spells and Incantations" seminar that's going on this weekend.

DM: Ok, done and done. You now have access to your new level of spells. Enjoy.

It's that easy. Now, if you don't think it should be that easy, that's fine but it's also a whole other topic of discussion.

 

[Dinkeldog]

What if I have no downtime? What if a character gains access to a spell level while slogging through a dungeon, having spent no real time studying, or anything resembling downtime except for sleeping and short resting? Does he have access to all those new spells for his level? The rules tells use they learn spells, not gain them automatically, like clerics. So what happens when you don't get a chance to learn them?

I would assume the same thing that happens to wizards in D&D that don't have downtime, but magically have two new spells in their books every level. *shrug*

 

[Apok]

But you can't casually drop an AU class into an existing D&D game and call it a day.

Actually, there are a couple that you could do just this with. Champion, Totem Warrior, Unfettered, Oathsworn, and Warmain could be dropped into an existing D&D game with no trouble.

And, in all honesty, you can just as easily use the standard D&D experience table for the AU classes. There was a reason Monte did the 10% increase, but it didn't have anything to do with the relative power of the AU classes.