[B.A.D.D] Red Discussion

[WizarDru]

Okay, if you're one of my players, you know the Drill, and you can figure out what this is about, so beat it.


Don't make use the breath weapon.





Thanks.



Anyhow, I figure that if people are passionate enough about B.A.D.D., they can offer me some Dragon ideas. My players, in an effort to confound me, appear to be opting for a quest I hadn't planned on for them for a little bit.

Namely this: For the first 13 or so levels of the campaign, they worked for a patron known as Lord Gelban, influential Greyhawk Merchant. Gelban was, in fact, a gold dragon, and known among his kind as the Gilden, speaker for the golds on the Scaled Council, an organization of Dragons dedicated to keeping stability in the Flanaess.

Long Story Short: The council shatters when the evil dragons decide to spoil the party, and the Infernus, speaker for the Reds, manages to best Gelban in battle (while the PCs are in full retreat, protecting his daughter).

Infernus takes Gelban back to Durance Vile, a demi-plane created by Ashardalon (from the adventure path series) as a private 'fortress' of sorts for the Reds. Ashardalon still dwells there, but no longer rules it, as it passes to the dragon who holds the title of Infernus. Gelban is being held prisoner, and constantly tortured with lava and other inducements of pain, primarly for the amusement of the reds against a most hated enemy. Durance Vile is adjacent to the Plane of Fire.

The party wants to rescue him. What I need are suggestions for the defenses of said demi-plane. What kind of beasties would Infernus have to patrol the place? What's to stop the players from just teleporting in, casting a Heal, and getting out of dodge, once they find a way onto the demiplane?

The Reds are arrogant, but not stupid. I also don't want to cheapen them by throwing a bunch of red Dragons at the party. There are six characters of 17th-18th level, a 14th level NPC (possibly two), mounts, an animal companion and most likely some help from some rogue coppers, bronzes and perhaps a silver or gold (the remaining good dragons being somewhat snafued in political problems).

So, what kind of ideas do you folks have? I want this to be an adventure worthy of the heroes, and possibly even one to force them to turn back, to try again later. I don't want to metagame the situation though, nor make it an unwinnable battle. I'm the DM, I can always do that. What I want is a logical set of defenses and strategies that Reds, including a ancient wyrm, might construct.

Fire me up!

 

[Carnifex]

Just a minor point from reading over it -golds are immune to fire, so how can the reds torture him with lava? The heat of the rocks'd do no damage, since its fire damage.

I suppose they could hit him with chunks of cooling lava

Anyway, on the subject of defences:

Lava traps. Such as in a tunnel where a red can kick out a tunnel wall that opens into a laval pool, promptly flooding the tunnel with magma rushing down it. Or similar lava-based nastiness.

Plenty of red half-dragon creatures, perhaps?

A band of efreet or salamander mercenaries that Ashardalon has on retainer, to act as guards for the place? (And who can perhaps be bribed to ease off some of the pressure on the PC's)?

 

[Wippit Guud]

Well, lets say we have 5 dragons to go against, which would be fitting for a dragon lord. Against 5 dragons, I'd be more worried about quench than harm... harm has spell resiatnce, quench doesnt (if you rule it affects red dragons).

So... step number 1: 4 dragons with rings of chameleon power. Aloows them to change self at will. Changin color is a simple issue, so you know have 5 red dragons, but 4 of them are not actually red, might have a blue, 2 blacks, and a white to worry about. Blows planning for just fire all to hell.

Worried about time stop... attack them with an illusionary dragon. They only get a save to interact with it. Timestop isn't interacting. They see dragon, cast timestop, and when they move to harm, THEN they realize it's an illusion. Waste the domain spell.

Have the dragon have a Clone spell cast. They kill it, he just comes back to life in a differetn body.

That's a start

 

[Derren]

There is the cleric spell Forbiddance which blocks all planar travel and even normal intrusion by creatures wh ar not a specified alingment.

Block the whole stronghold with this spell except maybe for one room which is used for teleporting in and out by the dragons. This room should be well defended (Traps which react to all except dragons) and inaccesable exept by flying and/or swimming through lava.

So your players have the chice between teleporting in this death room or teleporting near the stronghold and fight their way to the stronghold through hordes of fire elementals, salamander and maybe some efreeti slave overseer.

The enviroment should be very "fiery". Lava streams, mini vulcans, big vulcans, strong hot wind. Read the description of the elemental plane of fire to get an idea.

 

[Zenon]

A favored Red Dragon defense mechanism:

Iron Golems.

No worry about catching them in the Breath Weapon effect:

A fire effect breaks any slow effect on the golem and cures 1 point of damage for each 3 points of damage it would otherwise deal. For example, an iron golem hit by a fireball cast by a 5th-level wizard gains back 6 hit points if the damage total is 18. The golem rolls no saving throw against fire effects.

Heal the golems while hurting attackers. Win-win.

 

[JacktheRabbit]

How good is the Dragons intel on the party? I would hate to see tailor made defences that irritate your party as too many of their attacks are foiled.

 

[LuYangShih]

I love Dragons. Definitely make this an encounter that is extremely tough. The PCs shouldn't be able to win unless they use excellent tactics, forethought, planning and have a lot of luck. I'd like to say I think it's not very wise for the Red Dragons to keep the Gold Dragon alive. He should already be dead. But I guess they suffer from villian stupidity, and are going to leave a potentially dangerous adversary alive until he's rescued. Red Dragons are arrogant, but they're not stupid. Gelban should already be dead.

As for defenses, I agree with other posters that it should be a very fire based enviroment, especially in the interior where Infernus and Ashardalon are. Teleportation is easy to prevent, use Forbiddance and/or Unhallow tied to a Dimensional Anchor. In fact, all Dragon lairs should have such. The best advice I can give you, without knowing the specific statistics of the Dragons in question, is for the Dragons to take a proactive stance. Waiting around for the adventurers to reach them one by one is completely idiotic and unworthy of a Dragon, especially the Elder Wyrms.

I'd have the front gate guarded by a few fire creatures, Iron Golems, Efreet, Fire Giants and so on. Magical and mundane wards and traps should be set up as well. As soon as the party enters the area, at least two or three enemies should fly/run back into the fortress and inform the Dragons of the invaders. Once this is done, the Dragons congregate together and Scry on the party. Buffing spells commence, and the Dragons send many minions to harass the party. As soon as the party is engaged, the Dragons teleport in and wreak havoc.

They should immediately target those they have identified as spellcasters through scrying (shouldn't be difficult, with the Knowledge, Spot, and Spellcraft checks they have) and incinerate them. Or just rip them to pieces. If you have Dragons capable of casting ninth level spells, use them. A targeted Meteor Swarm on any Clerics or Wizards/Sorcerers in the party would be advisable. I could give more tactics here, but I'd have to know the Dragons statistics, the terrain they are going to be fighting in, and the makeup of your party.

Basically, the thing you should remember is, in D&D, whoever is being proactive and taking the attack to the enemy generally has the advantage. The Dragons shouldn't wait for the party to come to them. They should weaken/distract them with lesser minions, then quickly move in for the kill.

 

[WizarDru]

How good is the Dragons intel on the party? I would hate to see tailor made defences that irritate your party as too many of their attacks are foiled.

The Chromatics took less interest in the party as agents of the Scaled Council than the Metallics did, consequently they know some things about the party, but currently aren't fully aware of their full abilities.

Specifically they know that the party consists of:

1 Elven Champion (an arcane archer/sor/ftr)
1 Human Mage (wiz/Mage of the Arcane Order)
1 Shadowed of Pelor (cleric/hunter of the dead/radiant servant)
1 halfing druid (druid/verdant lord)
2 Paladins (1 elf PC, 1 human npc)
1 Shadowdancer (rog/shadowdancer/gatecrasher)

They are aware that the mage has 9th level spell capability, that the archer is ungodly efficient, that the cleric has dedicated his life to the utter destruction of the undead and that the Paladin has a blade that is essentially an artifact (that would be shatterspike, for the curious).

They are unaware that the party has a fortress of their own, Rhuun Kazaai, and that it is the reason they've had trouble scrying the party recently. This, combined with the party's recent off-planar travel has made them drop off the Red's radar. They know they might eventually try to rescue Gelban, but not when.

 

[WizarDru]

Just a minor point from reading over it -golds are immune to fire, so how can the reds torture him with lava? The heat of the rocks'd do no damage, since its fire damage.

I suppose they could hit him with chunks of cooling lava

Which brings us to part where I realize I'm an idiot. With both Fire subtype and Water-breathing, the current state they've seen him in is invalid. Mind you, he was being held by massive chains that were pulling him in four different directions, but the primary torture was meant to be dunking him into the magma flow.

Of course, that scrying was meant to be an illusion from the get-go, to counter B-S-T. I suppose it still can be, now with just an obvious fallacy. Which of course means a different torture is required. Hmmm.

A band of efreet or salamander mercenaries that Ashardalon has on retainer, to act as guards for the place? (And who can perhaps be bribed to ease off some of the pressure on the PC's)?

That's good. The players have a long-standing association with Djinn and have encountered previous salamander nobles. That would fit right in.

 

[WizarDru]

A favored Red Dragon defense mechanism:

Iron Golems.

Heal the golems while hurting attackers. Win-win.

You, sir, are devious. I LIKE devious. This is good. It's logical for the dragons to have, takes advantage of their abilities, isn't a fire-based creature (because I don't want everything to be fire-based...it makes things to easy with elemental resistances and prep-spells) and is clever.