Background Skills - Good Idea?

[Nightfall]

*would use background skills...but not sure if it would really work in the Scarred Lands.* at least not without some tweaking...

 

[LostSoul]

If the skills aren't going to be used for anything important, why have them at all?

More to the point - if there's something going on that's not important, why even include it in the game?

If it's important because you want to develop character, do you really need to roll to see how well John Smith can help out the struggling blacksmith in Littletown? Just say that he does and I think you're good.

if John Smith's player wants to make his Craft: Blacksmith or whatever important in the game, then he'll put ranks in there. The DM should see those ranks and say, "I need to put in challenges where John Smith needs to use his Craft skill."

I don't know... it's a good question.

It's too hot here.

 

[Nightfall]

*hands lost an iceberg* Here this should help.

I think skills are important...it's just the timing of them can affect their usefulness.

 

[Drowbane]

Group House Rules regarding Skills.

1) # of Skills as class +2 (thus: Fighters 4 + Int).
2) No class or cross-class skills. Skills are just... skills.
3) Skill mergings: Athletics (Climb, jump, swim), Acrobatics (balance and tumble), Disable Device (Disable Device and Open Locks), Perception (Listen and Spot), Stealth (Hide and Move Silently), etc, etc.

 

[Nightfall]

Did you happen to use Iron heroes idea for "skills" as a basis for that one Drowsbane?

 

[Nyaricus]

you could do it so that at first level, all skill are class skills and you get Int Mod + Number from Class x4 + 4 bonus skills or somesuch. I've been toying with this idea for awhile...

 

[skippy_the_witch]

My homebrew is very different from standard D&D (being a psuedo post-apocalyptic technomagic campaign) where a characters background defines not only what races he is able to take, but also what classes are likewise available. After figuring out what 2 of the 4 backgraounds will give a character (usually added class skills and a few specific minor feats), I used the background section of the Advanced GM's Guide to stat out the point cost (which worked out to be 20 and 21 respectively). The third background came to 19 points (still within margines), while the fourth only 12. Thus I gave my players from the Wild (the 12 point background) another 8 points to spend where they will (NOTE: these "points" ARE not skill points, just the way to even out backgrounds from the book...e.g. it costs 6 pts for a feat with prereq, but 4 points for a feat without prereq, etc...).

Outside of these backgrounds, which pretty much define most of a characters initial options for race, class, and even equipment, I also decided to give out bonus skill points, which MUST be spent on classes that I agree that fit with the character. I have one smart alec, a psionic gnoll, who accidentally put point in "Craft: Psionic" (a skill that really didn't exist), instead of Psicraft. Since I was slightly tickled by this, I have allowed him to spend his bonus points on this initially, and it has become his favorite "role-playing" skill, for I allow him to change the shape (but not the funtion or effects) of his mind blade and his powers (he is a Blade Manifester). Thus, his blade can end up being all kinds of pretty colors, look intimidating as hell (he once rolled a natural 20 on his "craft psionics" check when designing a new look for his blade, so I allowed that it was a shadowy form, made up of screaming/distorted faces wailing in silent horror), etc. If he ever decides to gain the ability to create astral constructs, his craft psionics skill will be used in place of craft scupture checks.

Anyway, sorry about the tangent. I give each player a number of bonus points at first level equal to their Cha bonus + Int bonus + Wis bonus. The idea is that you get points from being able to convince someone to teach you something (Cha bonus), how easily you learn new things (Int bonus), and how disciplined you are at learning new things (Wis bonus). This gives a bit of an advantage to the more "mental" characters than to the straight "jocks" or physical characters. Again, the skills these points are put to must be approved by me, the GM, and be appropriate to the character. And, yes, I have another player whose character is a whisper gnome ninja who is the "House Assassin" for a different player's nobleman PC (background, NOT class), so I allowed him to spend his background points on hide and move silently and the like, as his character does not even have a real name as such (house assassins being considered legally to be "autonomous" weapons of the noble house they belong to, not real persons).

skippy (who cannot seem to stay on message tonight...more tangents than geometry)
GM of the Cursed Earth Campaign

 

[Olaf the Stout]

Just curious Olaf, are you basing this in any way on the Black Company Campaign setting by Green Ronin or True d20?

No. It was just something that I came up with after having a discussion with one of my players. 10 skill points was just an arbitary number that I chose. I haven't seen the Black Company campaign setting or True d20. Do they have a similar system? I wasn't aware of any d20 game that had background skills (although it doesn't surprise me that some do).

Olaf the Stout

 

[EvilGM]

All new characters receive 4 ranks to distribute in any combo of Craft, Knowledge, Profession or Perform.
They also receive 4 ranks to distribute however they like in any Str or Dex based skill(s).

In addition, they get a bonus feat such as Alertness, etc. (one of the +2/+2 skill feats).

 

[Olaf the Stout]

I just wrote a post on the d20/OGL message board about giving extra skill points. My thesis was basically this:

The more skill points you give out, the less important skills will become in your game.

When players actually have to spend their precious skill points on crafting, profession, etc., then the ability to craft or perform or whatever is important. If they get it for free, it becomes meaningless.

If you want players to put skill points in profession, craft, or perform, then start calling for profession, craft, or perform checks. Invite them to the duke's ball, and then see how well they'll do on their dance checks. Let them influence the city's guildmasters with profession checks. Steal their equipment and put them in a jail cell or an uninhabited island and see how well they can make their own tools.

If it's just a matter of "I used to be a basketweaver", then let them have been a basketweaver without taking ranks--craft and perform can be used untrained.

That's another way of going about it. The only problem is that there are only so many situations where you can use some of the skills since some are more specialized than others. You can only put in so many situations that requires Craft:Basketweaving checks before it starts to become a little contrived. And then when the players level up next and put a few ranks in the skill you then have to continue to come up with reasons to include Craft:Basketweaving so they actually get to use the ranks.

Also, some players may still not take any ranks in background skills because they decide that Spot or Listen would still be a better choice, even if the GM does go out of his way to put Craft and Perform checks in.

Your point about the more skill points, the less important they are is true. A lot of people believe that all classes should have more skill points anyway though. I'm undecided as to whether they are or not.

Olaf the Stout