Bag of Rats Cheese ... No More!!!

[drnuncheon]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Bag of Rats Cheese ... No More!!!

So, effort has been made to modify a feat that didn't cause any actual game play probelms in order to eliminate the possibility of abuse that never actually occurred?

Good thinking. Useful effort that is.

Part of what the design team was trying to do with 3.5e was bring it closer to how people actually played. Disallowing the bag of rats is an incredibly common house rule for anyone that's heard of it.

Codifying that in the rules must have taken what, 30 seconds? Yep, that would have let them playtest a new metamagic system all right.

J

 

[LokiDR]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Bag of Rats Cheese ... No More!!!

So, effort has been made to modify a feat that didn't cause any actual game play probelms in order to eliminate the possibility of abuse that never actually occurred?

Good thinking. Useful effort that is.

I agree. But, as drnuncheon said, it probably didn't take much time. Maybe WWA will actually be useful in games I run now.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

There are DMs at the WotC boards who liked the trick. They said that if a fighter spent all of his feats and his dignity doing that he deserves a boost.

Sure... but not that much of a boost, IMO.

Oh well, it's about a fraction of a sentence to prevent a minor abuse (minor in how often it occurs). I don't see it as a big deal either way, but it's nice the design team thought to fix it.

 

[LokiDR]

There are DMs at the WotC boards who liked the trick. They said that if a fighter spent all of his feats and his dignity doing that he deserves a boost.

Sure... but not that much of a boost, IMO.

Oh well, it's about a fraction of a sentence to prevent a minor abuse (minor in how often it occurs). I don't see it as a big deal either way, but it's nice the design team thought to fix it.

The limiting factor, IMO, are the rats. If you want to take them all out of the bag, one or a few at a time, the setup would keep down abuse. I agree with DMs at the WotC boards.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

I don't see why a fighter can't carry a "bucket o' snails" and throw dozens of them into the air at once.

I think it's silly that a fighter would do that ... after all, you can pass a bucket full of water, or snails, from one end of a village to another faster than the speed of sound, and I doubt that's been changed.

The supersonic monk is probably going to disappear, however (eg no more super-stacking items).

 

[LokiDR]

I don't see why a fighter can't carry a "bucket o' snails" and throw dozens of them into the air at once.

I think it's silly that a fighter would do that ... after all, you can pass a bucket full of water, or snails, from one end of a village to another faster than the speed of sound, and I doubt that's been changed.

The supersonic monk is probably going to disappear, however (eg no more super-stacking items).

If you drop a bucket, how can you stike the snails in it? Go ahead, cleave the bucket. 1 extra attack isn't a big deal.

Funny part is, I could never make the supersonic calculations come out, especially since the monk's speed is supernatural after a certain point. Best I ever got was diving, expeditious retreat, oldest age dragon. Still misses supersonic, but it gets closer than anything else.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

1) Uncover bucket.
2) Move the bucket upwards, rapidly. Do not release bucket!!!
3) While snails are in the air, use broken combo. (This works better with Haste 3.0, since I'm not sure if unleashing the snails if a free action. No one bothered to clarify it.)
4) Eventually you'll roll a "1" but your opponent might be dead by that point. Unless they have really odd DR and 300+ hit points.
5) Do it again, but with a vorpal weapon ... by increasing the number of attack rolls you increase your chance of decapitating someone. It's a bit funny when you decapitate a snail, however.

Supersonic monks? I've never tried the calculations myself, but they involved the Jump skill. Personally I don't care if they could reach supersonic speeds ... the practical limitations (eg visual range) were enough of a "balancing" consideration.

However, being able to move at like 300 ft. per round is going overboard, if you ask me.

 

[Destil]

Oh, come on. This was just a silly oversight in the original rules and few DMs would have seriouslly allowed it. you don't even need some bucked of snails, a 1st level cohort with a wand of Summon Montser III summoning 1d4+1 monsters and ordering them to move through your thretened area was enugh.

As long as it dosn't disallow AoOs I'm happy and see little reason anyone would complain about it for anything other than the sake of complaining...

 

[Destil]

If you drop a bucket, how can you stike the snails in it? Go ahead, cleave the bucket. 1 extra attack isn't a big deal.

Funny part is, I could never make the supersonic calculations come out, especially since the monk's speed is supernatural after a certain point. Best I ever got was diving, expeditious retreat, oldest age dragon. Still misses supersonic, but it gets closer than anything else.

For my best effort I got around 800 MPH with a hasted, diving something or other with a lot of psionic feats... May have been using something clearly against the intent of the rules like a psionic half celestial (winged) cheata sprinting, though...

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

Oh, come on. This was just a silly oversight in the original rules and few DMs would have seriouslly allowed it.

Yes... and yes. The operative word being "few" rather than none.

800 MPH? Wow! At sea level, the speed of sound is about 1,200 kph, or about 660 MPH.