Book of Vile Darkness

[Xarlen]

I will say that after slogging through 3 pages that were added between my classes... Yeesh.

Okay, look Folks, this book will not change your aligment to chaotic evil when you pick it up. C'mon. It's not the end-all-be-all instruction manual to being evil. Infact, considering the 'evil' that Monte does, I don't think it will be any more horrid then RttoToEE.

I remember when I was a kid, there was a Nintendo game called Taboo. On the box, it said 'No one under 16'. My mom refused to let me play it. If a parent sees 'Mature rating', then they're not going to buy it for their kid. Or if they do, then they Don't Care, so what's the point?

Really, I mean, c'mon. First of all, why are 12 year olds buying this book? Is it to DM evil better? I'd prefer they get a book that tells them how to DM Better, period. Like a splatbook, this isn't Core. Thus, there's no need for everyone to buy it.

I'll point out that EVIL, a product allready on the market, has Demon and Devil worship rules. The book is called EVIL, for gods' sake, and it hasn't earned any flack. Yes, Mazes and Monsters hurt the RPG community, but that is no longer a problem.

As to evil being in this world... We don't have rules for said evil. And, I know *I* don't want to put Osama in my game. Now, a witch who swims in the blood of innocents, and uses that same lifeblood to fuel her magics, Give Me That. Or better, give me the Mechanics for that.

Mongoose put out Demonology. It hasn't seen any flames.

Next, I gotta ask... If BoVD destroys the familiy values of D&D (A game basicly founded on killing stuff, more or less) Then those parents aren't really making good family values.

I remember one guy complaining about the nudity in the MM, and how he can't show his family. Does that mean that we should tailor the MM, because it's got 'naughty bits' and the monsters have curves?

 

[barsoomcore]

I remember one guy complaining about the nudity in the MM, and how he can't show his family. Does that mean that we should tailor the MM, because it's got 'naughty bits' and the monsters have curves?

More curvy monsters! Bring 'em on!

I've got it! WotC's next release will be The Book of Naughty Bits. Uh-huh. Now that'll need GRAPHIC artwork.

 

[Xarlen]

With Mialee, Vadania, and Alexandra?

 

[Wolfspider]

More curvy monsters! Bring 'em on!

I've got it! WotC's next release will be The Book of Naughty Bits. Uh-huh. Now that'll need GRAPHIC artwork.

Hmmm...but will they be CRUNCHY Naughty Bits?

 

[barsoomcore]

Hmmm...but will they be CRUNCHY Naughty Bits?

...


...


*runs away.*

 

[Renshai]

I did read the entire thread, thank you. Its basically post after post of you predicting that the Book of Vile Darkness is going to cast some horrible shadow over Dungeons and Dragons.

The people that think Dungeons and Dragons is evil will always think it is evil, new people will form their own opinions by actually studying the subject matter or not. If they take one book and decide that the entire game is evil, it is their problem, not mine, yours, or the hobby's problem. The problem is simply the conclusion of a narrow minded person.

Point in fact, you have made comments about how a good DM should not need such a book, when it is obvious that there are plenty of solid DMs around here who look forward to it. I can't wait to see a book that focuses on the evil aspects of villains in the Dungeons and Dragons world, and I doubt seriously that it will the negative impact on the game that you are going on about...

Ren

 

[ThomasBJJ]

BoVD, I'll buy it.

 

[Xarlen]

Y'know, in 2e, a 'Complete Villains Handbook' was created. No flack there, and I remember mention inside of a man eating dogs. Infact, his soldiers, if cornered, would attack with their *TEETH*.

No screaming from that, nope.

 

[ColonelHardisson]

There was the Necromancer book from TSR also. It's a good book, but it is a bit more...let's say "graphic," for lack of a better word, than other TSR books of the time. Not much of a brouhaha over it either.

 

[MeepoTheMighty]

Hehe. Those ESRB ratings are generally regarded as pretty vague and virtually worthless by the (video)gaming community.

Take a look at 3 video games with MA ratings (go to IGN or GameSpot for more info if you need it): Eternal Darkness, Grand Theft Auto 3, and BMX XXX (formerly Dave Mirra XXX). Now they are three wholly different games.

GTA 3: Guns, violence, cursing, theft, murder, prostitution, sexual content, etc.

BMX XXX: Nudity (topless strippers, topless female bike riders), sexual content, cursing, vulgar themes.

Eternal Darkness: No nudity or cursing (save for the rare use of 'damn' or 'hell'), yet it received an MA rating due to it's dark storyline, sacrifices, ritualistic magic, some gore, and violence (it's very Lovecraftian in nature).

Now, while they all have MA ratings, they're certainly 3 different types of 'maturity'.

Personally, if WotC wants to release mature products akin to Eternal Darkness (which seems to be the case with BoVD, or even CoC), I see no problem with that, nor would I think they'd need to market it under a different brand or identity.

However, if it's pure smut like BMX XXX, then I can see a problem. GTA 3 falls somewhere in the middle, though it's clearly closer to the smut side of things.

My point is, there are different types of 'mature' content, and some forms are arguably more 'mature' than others. The ESRB just lumps them all together and is not a very good indicator of what a game really contains.

(NOTE: I'm not railing against GTA 3 or most MA-rated games... they're obviously quite popular, and I've admittedly enjoyed a bit of GTA 3 myself)

Dead or Alive Beach Volleyball might contain see-thru swimsuits and even full frontal nudity, with pubic hair, and still retain an M rating. In the article I read, they weren't yet sure how far they were going to go, but apparently you can show anything short of actual depictions of sex and still be rated M as opposed to Adults-Only (AO).

The point of the article is that game companies are noticing that their major demographic is the 18+ crowd, the guys who played nintendo 10 years ago and kept on playing. Therefore more companies are starting to push the envelope of good taste in order to attract these older games who can buy whatever the hell they want.

Er, where was I going with this? I dunno.