D&D (2024) Buffing Int, Wis, and Cha (Mostly Int and Cha)

[Xeviat]

And some ideas I had:

• Rather than announcing things players know, use passive skills and write notes to players, letting them decide what to share
• Cap literacy at 1+int modifier languages—you can speak the languages from your BG but, if you’re int 8 you can’t read. Illiteracy used to be super common.
• Use int saves for hints here an player misses a clue their PC might have put together
• Use cha saves to prevent a scandal when a character does something rude or embarrassing

I really like these ideas. That makes me want to use Charisma saves to resist fear and emotion effects, because it's your sense of self

 

[ezo]

I really like these ideas. That makes me want to use Charisma saves to resist fear and emotion effects, because it's your sense of self

We also use CHA as conviction--so it makes sense to use it to resist fear and in much of 5E it already is used for that.

Of course, it has become our spellcasting ability for Cleric as well. Just makes more sense than Wisdom IMO.

 

[Xeviat]

We also use CHA as conviction--so it makes sense to use it to resist fear and in much of 5E it already is used for that.

Of course, it has become our spellcasting ability for Cleric as well. Just makes more sense than Wisdom IMO.

I wanted to have Clerics be Cha before. Would make the base 3 casters split evenly between Int, Wis, and Cha. Could put a decision in each caster, actually.

Bard: Int (historian) or Cha (performer)
Cleric: Wis (monk) or Cha (priest)
Druid: Int (witch) or Wis (shaman)
Sorcerer: Wis (self) or Cha (soul)
Warlock: Int (occult) or Cha (bargainer)
Wizard: Int (scholar) or Wis (intuitive)

Aside from my desire to make Sorcerers Con, this could add flexibility. Could the half-casters work the same?

Artificer: Int (inventor) or Cha (awakener)
Paladin: Wis (insightful) or Cha (prophet)
Ranger: Int (woodsman) or Wis (wildman)

I'm not sold on Cha for some Artificers, but that could maybe work for someone who awakens the spirits of items with their power. Or it if you're down for Physical casters, they could be Dex for building gadgets with precise coordination.

 

[KryHavok]

Aside from my desire to make Sorcerers Con

One thing I love from Pillars of Eternity is how they make physical abilities useful for casters and mentals valuable to martials. E.g. Your crit range with weapon attacks could be natural 20 minus half your int mod, so an 18 int would crit on 18-20 (although I actually prefer crits to just maximize rolled damage rather than double it — criting with a great axe for 2 damage is lame).

For wizards I always like the idea that the limiting factor of magic is how much junk they have to cart around. Tomes are heavy, and for some reason wiz bro wants six (str). Plus he’s got a literal bag of poop he says is necessary for fireballs (con). Constantly whining about how his rare herbs are wilting (wis) and is constantly chatting people up asking about dead old wizards whose names I can’t even pronounce… (cha)

 

[Kobold Avenger]

One thing I love from Pillars of Eternity is how they make physical abilities useful for casters and mentals valuable to martials.

But in Pillars of Eternity I remember that Might the Strength equivalent attribute was a bonus to damage with everything: melee weapons, firearms and spells.

 

[ezo]

I wanted to have Clerics be Cha before. Would make the base 3 casters split evenly between Int, Wis, and Cha. Could put a decision in each caster, actually.

Bard: Int (historian) or Cha (performer)
Cleric: Wis (monk) or Cha (priest)
Druid: Int (witch) or Wis (shaman)
Sorcerer: Wis (self) or Cha (soul)
Warlock: Int (occult) or Cha (bargainer)
Wizard: Int (scholar) or Wis (intuitive)

Aside from my desire to make Sorcerers Con, this could add flexibility. Could the half-casters work the same?

Artificer: Int (inventor) or Cha (awakener)
Paladin: Wis (insightful) or Cha (prophet)
Ranger: Int (woodsman) or Wis (wildman)

I'm not sold on Cha for some Artificers, but that could maybe work for someone who awakens the spirits of items with their power. Or it if you're down for Physical casters, they could be Dex for building gadgets with precise coordination.

Sure this would work well and I might steal part of it LOL.

Our current iteration (things change often enough) is

INT: Wizards (Bards)
WIS: Druids (Rangers)
CHA: Clerics (Paladins)

Of course, sorcerers are a subclass of wizard and warlocks a subclass of cleric. Artificiers don't exist.

Even in our more RAW games with much less house-rules, Sorcerers are CON, but Clerics remain WIS then...

 

[g00se99994]

I really like this. Then we fuse Con with Str, and boom, much easier to silo things (and saves!).

DC20 does something very close to this

 

[jmartkdr2]

I really like these ideas. That makes me want to use Charisma saves to resist fear and emotion effects, because it's your sense of self

This is good but only if it's something they could have been convinced of - I had a dm overuse this and it was annoying.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I miss Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma having functions outside of their skills and saves (and magic for casters). In 3E, Int gave extra skill points and languages. This kept it from being dumped to the floor, or at least made you feel it if your character idea came with an 8 Int; I know I only considered it for Barbarians, because they got 4 skill points per level so I felt okay losing one.

Wisdom is always painful to dump because Perception is useful for everyone and Wisdom saves are important.

Charisma is always easy to dump because it just has its skills and rare Charisma saves.

So, what could be added to Intelligence and Charisma to make them feel less easy to dump and more beneficial to boost?

What if Intelligence offered extra languages or tool proficiencies? Current characters get 2 languages in 2024. Instead it could be Common +1 language, with additional languages or tools per Int mod. Int could also decrease the time needed to learn new languages or tools (but I haven't seen that rule in the 2024 phb).

Wisdom is probably fine. Perception and Wisdom saves are important for everyone. Passive Perception is like a feature.

Charisma is tougher. In older editions, Charisma had a reaction bonus, or it was used for determining NPC reactions upon meeting them. Charisma could be for Hero Points or Inspiration (charismatic characters in fiction are often lucky or confident). Charisma could be for NPC contacts, showing that you make friends where you go. It could also be for a Reputation/Fame/Infamy feature.

What do you think?

In Level Up, your Intelligence bonus gives you additional skill focuses (expertise dice that add to your ability check when dealing with a topic more narrow than a basic skill). It's awesome. Happy to explain further if anyone's interested.

 

[ezo]

In Level Up, your Intelligence bonus gives you additional skill focuses (expertise dice that add to your ability check when dealing with a topic more narrow than a basic skill). It's awesome. Happy to explain further if anyone's interested.

Do you receive endorsement payments???