D&D 5E Campaign Settings 5e- Why I want to Forget the Realms

[Irennan]

That's a retcon. It contradicted what we already knew (or, as you put it, wasn't explored fully- I do enjoy euphemsisms!). Not that there's necesarily anything wrong with that; comic books and RPGs are full of them.

AFAIK a retcon overwrites some previously established knowledge, making it null or altering it. In-lore, the FR are what Elminster tells us about the world, the knowledge about them is not really reliable or complete. The introduction of Eilistraee is one of the things that were told later (and not that much later, since she was introduced as soon as we received some details on the drow culture, in 1991).

Besides, as I said, considering that Ed had already created Eilistraee, Vhaeraun and different drow cultures for the setting, since he meant the race to have variety, I don't really see it as a retcon.

I believe that's a contradiction in the same statement. It was the popularity of Drizzt that led to it- that's Drizzt-related. The technical term for that is a fortiori.

What I meant is that Eilistraee is unique as a character. She isn't related to Drizzt, nor are her followers.

This is really the heart of the disagreement. A long time ago, I was friends with a DM that ran an amazing campaign. The players played various characters (drow, duregar, deep gnome in alliance, etc.) that were rebelling against the evil races in the underdark. This made sense. What doesn't make sense is "random party of adventurers with myserious, yet good-aligned drow, that goes on generic adventures and never as any issues over the fact that they have a dark elf in the party."

Oh, yes, that I get. You should have an appropriate story in order for Eilistraeens --or drow, or other ''rare'' races in general-- to actually feel fitting.

History is minor. It's flavor. Especially given that the vast majority of people won't know about it (random villager doesn't think about long-lost kingdoms, even assuming s/he is aware of it). Of course, as we've established that roughly 78% of FR NPCs are at least 15th level, with 23% being good-aligned dark elves that are just misunderstood, perhaps the knowledge base is a little different?

It's not a minor part of the setting, especially when it's the whole reason why the drow have become what they are now. It's part of the setting continuity and the Crown Wars have still influence on the current era. They remove the black and white drow=wrong and elves=right and introduce a more grey situation where both factions have committed atrocities in said wars, and where no faction is fully in the right. The slaughtering of the dark and green elves of Miyeritar is an example, the fact that many elves perceive Eilistraee as a threat to their doctrine that the drow are to blame for all the bad stuff that happened to both people in the history of the setting; the existence of a whole faction of elves and a god dedicated to the slaughtering of all drow, no matter what is another (IIRC, in a story they kill one of their own because she tried to protect a drow child).

Also, c'mon. The misunderstood good aligned drow is just a trope. 1)Eilistraeens are not all good (they can easily be neutral) 2)they are drow who work to build a future for their whole race, in the surface world, and enjoy their life (and make others enjoy it too, when possible) instead of being forced to follow some cookie cutter evil dogma, or live underground eating mushrooms.

 

[Remathilis]

I never said I liked Greyhawk's medieval setting either - still tired of it. And, in the case of the antagonists, "unrealistic enemies that make no sense" is not a trope. That's just lazy writing. Giving gunpowder to gnomes is not a trope- that's a different decision separate from a lot of things; Greyhawk's gnomes didn't have it. My dislike of the Wall of the Faithless is not a common D&D trope, nor the gods themselves - I don't dislike Greyhawk's pantheon like I do FR's.

So, your 95% comment actually... isn't. The only part that holds up is being tired of medieval europe.

Hyper-masculine orcs have existed since Tolkien (King of the Lazy Writer?) And matriarchal drow are in all D&D except Eberron.

Gnomes having technology are a D&D trope as well: in tinker gnomes in Dragonlance and flying gnome machines in Mystara. Gnomes with gunpowder is just Realms version.

As to the God's thing, the Wall is just an expression of the Gods' influence. You say you don't like GH gods either, but nearly every setting (save Dark Sun) has some variant of it.

I'm not saying you are wrong to dislike them, but most of the things you cite are not exclusive to the Realms.

 

[Greg K]

And matriarchal drow are in all D&D except Eberron.

There are drow in Darksun? When did that happen?

 

[lowkey13]

*Deleted by user*

 

[Remathilis]

There are drow in Darksun? When did that happen?

How about "in all settings that have drow in them, they are matriarchal (except Eberron)" since DS, Mystara, and (I think) Dragonlance doesn't have them.

As an aside, Dark Sun really shouldn't count in any discussion on D&D tropes since the point of Dark Sun is to break all the D&D tropes. You can refute every D&D trope with "not in Dark Sun"; the role of magic, gods, psionics, weapons and armor, races, monsters, dragons, and the classes themselves don't confirm. To me, its a totally different game that just happened to use the d20 system rules.

 

[Evenglare]

How about "in all settings that have drow in them, they are matriarchal (except Eberron)" since DS, Mystara, and (I think) Dragonlance doesn't have them.

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Dragonlance has dark elves but not in the traditional sense. They are merely exiled elves for messing around in dark magic. Dalamar being the biggest example.

 

[Corpsetaker]

.

The vast quantities of ultra-powerful adventurers, NPC, artifacts, etc. for adventure and story purposes:
1. Overshadow PC achievements ("You're a 12th level wizard? Who cares? There are literally 100 other ones in this city!").
2. Inconsistently have no impact on the background feel of the world (which remains stolidly generic medieval fantasy).
3. Draws too much focus to the natural mechanical breakdown of high-level D&D play (in that the powers and capabilities of said characters have no real correlation to fantasy fiction characters even within the FR canon or whose mechanical quirks make verisimilitude a challenge, such as a measurable percentage of the FR populace being able to fall 5000 feet onto solid stone, easily sucking up the 20d6 falling damage and walking away whistling).

Finally, FR splatbooks from the 3X era were some of the worst WotC ever put out--poorly edited, poorly conceived and just broken.

Nope. Not a fan.

Sounds to me like you just aren't clued in to the Realms.

Let's look at your first one: That goes for "all: established settings in D&D as well as most home worlds I would say. The world doesn't sit there static waiting on your group to level up. Also, what was the world doing before you came along? You just aren't a fan of settings period.

Second one: Have you actually sat down and read up on the Realms?

Third: That has nothing to do with the Forgotten Realms. You have a problem with the rules of D&D but decide to blame the Realms for some reason.

 

[aramis erak]

1. Why was FR chosen as the default? I understand that 5e had a lot of feedback, so is this the most popular campaign setting in general?

There is no chance of having to pay royalties to the Gygax estate with the Realms - the setting was bought outright by TSR, and explicitly included in the sale to Wizards. And Ed Greenwood signed over ALL rights to the Realms, and has stated publicly that he did so. Further, Ed's still alive, and working with/for Wizards as an author.

Greyhawk, however, was Gary's creation, and while included in the sale of TSR, Gary never clearly signed over all rights to it. Gail could, in theory, demand royalties on it. And mire the works in litigation for years.

Add to that the continued success of the Realms as a setting for Novels... an outside source for new fans. I've seen FR novels on elementary school library shelves...

And that the more successful D&D videogames have all been set in the realms...

Plenty of cumulative reasons to pick FR over Greyhawk. I prefer Mystarra, myself.... and Greyhawk over the realms... but it's not THAT big a deal.

 

[epithet]

I've never been able to rationalize uniformity in a race of chaotic folk, so in my worlds the drow are a sub-set of dark elves that worship Lolth. There are other dark elves that do not, and there is definately conflict between them. The Drow consider non-Drow dark elves to be heretics, worse than the surface elves. But the dark elves are still dark elves, and are chaotic neutral with evil tendencies. They participate in the underdark slave trade and all manner of nefarious acts.

Just because there is variety among my dark elves doesn't mean there's a bunch of "good" ones.

I apply the same thought process to orcs. There's no way they all maintain the same culture, they're chaotic. I tend to like to have my orcs act like vikings--they raid, pillage, and wreak havoc, but they're also open to trade and can be bribed quite effectively.

 

[epithet]

... good goddesses have a tendency to be naked, evil ones have a tendency to be kinky...

Well, if you've taken the trouble to manifest a perfect physical form, don't you want to show it off? And I think they're all kinky... the evil ones just get off to your pain.

With all the violence inherent in a game of murder-hobo antics, it would be bizarre if there was some kind of taboo against sexuality in any D&D setting. I know a lot of people gasp in horror and ask "What about the children?" but I say, if your kid's character can shove a sword through a goblin or set it on fire and watch it burn to death, then that character can also see a pair of goddess boobs without freaking the hell out.