Can You Empower Claws of the Beast?

[KarinsDad]

So, are you saying that a summoned monster is not an effect of summon monster? If it is an effect, then why wouldn't its hit points, attack rolls, and damage all be effects?

Because the variable numeric portions of it are not specified within the "spell effect".

 

[Hypersmurf]

I don't think damage is the effect of claws of the beast. It affects "You," and you do not take damage.

Would you allow an Empowered Fire Shield, dealing (1d6+X) x 1.5 damage to those who strike the target?

I certainly would.

-Hyp.

 

[pawsplay]

Would you allow an Empowered Fire Shield, dealing (1d6+X) x 1.5 damage to those who strike the target?

I certainly would.

-Hyp.

This spell wreathes you in flame and causes damage to each creature that attacks you in melee.

So yes, yes I would.

 

[Hypersmurf]

This spell wreathes you in flame and causes damage to each creature that attacks you in melee.

So yes, yes I would.

But the target is "You". Doesn't that mean, then, that a spell can have an effect on something that is not the target?

Doesn't that mean that 'It affects "You," and you do not take damage' is irrelevant when determining whether damage to another creature is an effect of a Personal spell or power?

-Hyp.

 

[pawsplay]

But the target is "You". Doesn't that mean, then, that a spell can have an effect on something that is not the target?

-Hyp.

Yes. That doesn't mean that claws of the beast is such an ability though. Clearly, the result of the spell is to grant a natural claw attack, complete with damage scaling for size. It is not to cause damage magically.

For instance, you can use claws of the beast and never make an attack at all. Whereas fireshield does damage continuously under certain circumstances.

Claws of the beast also does not allow PR and is not a conjuration effect. Further, I'm pretty sure they can be used to damage golems.

 

[KarinsDad]

For instance, you can use claws of the beast and never make an attack at all. Whereas fireshield does damage continuously under certain circumstances.

Claws of the Beast does damage under certain circumstances. You hit with an attack roll.

Not much different than Scorching Ray.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Claws of the beast also does not allow PR and is not a conjuration effect. Further, I'm pretty sure they can be used to damage golems.

What's your stance on Flame Arrow, then?

-Hyp.

 

[pawsplay]

Claws of the Beast does damage under certain circumstances. You hit with an attack roll.

Not much different than Scorching Ray.

It's completely different. Claws of the beast gives you claws, with which you attack. Scorching ray magically scorches things, and if you decide you want to actually hit something with that ray, you make an attack roll. Nothing about casting claws of the beast causes you to pick up those d4s. Whereas scorching ray causes an attack just by being cast.

Other differences:
Scorching ray affects one or more targets, claws affects you
Scorching ray causes magical damage, claws causes claw damage
Scorching ray does a certain amount of damage dictated by the spell, claws does damage as claws as described by the spell and is affected by size increases.
Scorching ray won't work on a golem, claws of the beast likely will.
Scorching ray is a ray spell that causes an attack, claws of the beast is a power that simply causes you to grow claws.
Scorching ray allows you to cast and blast, claws of the beast is specified as a swift action and attacking with the claws is done as per any other natural weapon.

I would compare claws of the beast with polymorphing into a dire tiger. Can you empower and maximize that?

 

[pawsplay]

What's your stance on Flame Arrow, then?

-Hyp.

Can be empowered and maximized. I consider it very similar in that respect to flaming sphere or fireshield.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Can be empowered and maximized. I consider it very similar in that respect to flaming sphere or fireshield.

So it's a non-Conjuration spell that targets an object, doesn't allow SR, but deals Empowerable damage to something that isn't the target.

Scorching ray affects one or more targets, Flame Arrow affects arrows.
Scorching ray causes magical damage, Flame Arrow causes fire damage.
Scorching ray won't work on a golem, Flame Arrow likely will.
Scorching ray is a ray spell that causes an attack, Flame Arrow is a spell that simply augments an arrow.
Scorching ray allows you to cast and blast, attacking with Flame Arrow is done as per any other projectile weapon.

claws does damage as claws as described by the spell and is affected by size increases.

And is also affected by Augmentation. A more powerful version of the power results in the claws dealing more damage. Why should 'more magic' from augmentation make the damage greater, but 'more magic' from Empower not be applicable?

-Hyp.