Cat Advice (very off topic)

[Umbran]

In Britain we almost all let cats go outside. Sometimes they get killed, but they always seem a lot happier than any kept-indoors cat I've ever seen.

With respect, veterinarians don't generally buy that argument any more.

The average lifespan for an outdoor cat is 2 to 5 years in the US. An indoor cat will live 13 to 17 years on average. The outdoors is laden with parasites, disease, poisons, and injury from a variety of sources. In addition, owners of indoor cats are much more likely to see health problems developing early, and get them treated.

There is a romanticized view of the domestic cat as a wild animal, with "needs". They are no longer wild animals. They are domesticated. If you are spending a minimum of effort to make the indoors a good home for the cat, it will be plenty happy, and live in that happiness on average 3x as long.

 

[meltdownpass]

Realistically this is a moral question which leans heavily on your weighing of highly debateable terms like domesticated and Good. The appeal to authority doesn't bring anything useful to the discussion, and it seems unlikely to resolve philosophical questions that've been around for thousands of years.

 

[Umbran]

Realistically this is a moral question which leans heavily on your weighing of highly debateable terms like domesticated and Good. The appeal to authority doesn't bring anything useful to the discussion, and it seems unlikely to resolve philosophical questions that've been around for thousands of years.

I think you misunderstand "appeal to authority".

Appeal to authority is when you take the word of an authority figure because they are an authority figure. This is not the same as taking the word of an authority figure because they have studied the issue and thus have information you do not.

Each of is merely human. We do not have enough hours in our lives to study all subjects. This is why we specialize in various areas - so that we can have access to skills and information we ourselves cannot build in our lifetime. If you really want to call this a moral question, then how moral can it be to make judgements on the welfare of another living being when with no expertise or significant rigorous study in that welfare?

 

[Nellisir]

I've only got a moment, but basically, everything Umbran has said.

Cats are HIGHLY variable. My gf has 4. My best friend (a vet) currently has 4 (she's had up to 6 at a time). I have 2 at the moment. They are ALL different. Mine are SUPER-social & friendly with me, and slightly social and friendly with other people. My gf's are all over the place. My friend's are likewise (and hers currently include two ex-feral cats).

Couple notes:

• Your cat sounds a bit stressed and generally anti-social. Not at all feral. Some cats be like that.
• You've got a wife and dog(s?). Cats often have a favorite person. My cats with me are basically like dogs. They follow me around CONSTANTLY. If I'm there, they're there. But if she's meowing at your wife, that's a big plus. That's kitten to adult behavior.
• Cats have texture preferences. If she's not going for the climbing tree, try other products. Mine really like the roughness of sisal or jute rope. They're iffy on cardboard. They love my office chair fabric, for some reason, which actually appears able to take it. They also love my sofa, which can't.

 

[Nellisir]

Also, outdoor cats slaughter huge numbers of birds. Immense numbers. It's insane. And I've lost a cat to HPV, and another to a car, and most of the neighborhood cats are gone now because of the local foxes. One got nailed in our driveway last fall. I interrupted but the cat (a really BIG mean old neutered tomcat) didn't survive.

 

[meltdownpass]

I think you misunderstand "appeal to authority".

Appeal to authority is when you take the word of an authority figure because they are an authority figure. This is not the same as taking the word of an authority figure because they have studied the issue and thus have information you do not.

I understand the appeal to authority perfectly fine. The point you're making is that because veterinarians study the biology of animals, that they are therefore authorities on ethical & moral matters. This does not follow.

It's certainly worth thinking about these issues and reading wisdom & philosophy to develop your own moral framework to inform your views of how you act in the world, and how your actions impact other beings. However it's not demonstrable to say that one or another approach is better in an objective sense, nor that there's any way we could determine "authority" in these matters.

Those who are wealthy in European or European-diaspora communities probably err on the side of keeping their pets safe. I know I do. That being said, we shouldn't gloss over that our fuzzy math of X quality of life and Y years comes from a particular moral framework that not everyone shares, and for good reason. Ultimately the relationship between a cat and its human companion is something that needs to be negotiated between them and I don't think it's altogether helpful to try to suggest any one solution is best.

 

[Zardnaar]

In NZ cats outside is kind of the default.

Nothing dangerous in terms of wildlife.

List two to cars over the years, one got sick from fighting but he had preexisting renal problems.

Current motley pair we have had 10 years. Not sure how old they are SPCA said 1-2. They were young when we got them.

Declawing is regarded as cruel here and not letting your cat out is regarded as unusual. Declawing is illegal as well.

One was a good hunter but mostly got introduced birds anyway the rare natives are no where close. He doesn't catch much now but he depopulated the neighbors mouse nest.

 

[DrunkonDuty]

In Oz outdoor cats is the default too.

But it shouldn't be.

There's the additional dangers to the cat as folks have listed above.

There's also the predation on local species. It's a big problem here in Australia. @Zardnaar, do you think the reason the native species aren't anywhere nearby might be predation by cats?

 

[Nellisir]

In Oz outdoor cats is the default too.

But it shouldn't be.

There's the additional dangers to the cat as folks have listed above.

There's also the predation on local species. It's a big problem here in Australia. @Zardnaar, do you think the reason the native species aren't anywhere nearby might be predation by cats?

The damage cats do | The Morgan Foundation

 

[Zardnaar]

In Oz outdoor cats is the default too.

But it shouldn't be.

There's the additional dangers to the cat as folks have listed above.

There's also the predation on local species. It's a big problem here in Australia. @Zardnaar, do you think the reason the native species aren't anywhere nearby might be predation by cats?

I don't live near the endangered species. If I did cats are indoors.

The feral get shot, trapped etc. The only native the cat gets is fantails and they're common enough.