CG vs. LE: Chaotic Good is Victorious!

[Evilhalfling]

and the 2000th post goes to PJSlavner

Step to 45n25e and full attack at pa 5
"Charm person, really? You have broad definitions of a person Eieio"

 

[PJSlavner]

Round 568

Drum hits with everything but one claw and wing (worst hitting roll 43-5=38; best missing roll 38-5=33) for a total of 63+20=83 points of damage. Eieio also takes 17 points of damage from the sticky acid. Eieio has 199 HP remaining.

 

[ugulu]

"Charm person, really? You have broad definitions of a person Eieio"

Not as broad as the hole you're going to tear in my over-CR'd hide...

I think the part of this late-game thing that is wearing me down is the achilles-heel aspect. I have not played high-levels (14+) yet so I'm wondering - anyone think this uber-beholder would last more than a round or two vs. a 19th-level group of PC's?

Adding rinky-dink sorceror levels doesn't seem to do much but add to the CR w/o making it much more lethal than the base beholder. So it seems to be down to dragon vs. dragon.

On the upside I am learning a lot about bad monster design. What spell-casting dragon would not have Resist Energy? Or a healing spell? In the case of the time-bird, Time Stop is great - but if you don't have a rack of good duration-based attack spells...or maybe saves equivalent to a 10th-level PC, it ain't gonna help.

How much do you think we would affect the CR of a critter if we were able to take the base creature, then (maybe using only SRD) re-key feats and spells?

 

[Evilhalfling]

Ugulu
at least +1, or +2 if they have a lot of bad choices.
but that may only bring them up too par, not above where they are listed. (reads chrotyn)
the other key use for time stop would be buff spells, you had a few but the confusion took them away. +15 on saves isn't bad, few PCs can force dc 30+ saves

I have only once run a game past 13th level, and BoAA helped my tacitics and monster design considerably.

 

[ugulu]

One knock against the Chronotryn is really only there b/c dragon breath is (Su) - if it was a SLA it would have had to punch through SR31 - so getting something through to a +10 Will save take some effort. I'm thinking of the evoker in the game I run.

From memory: 12th-level, INT 19 (21 with Headband of Intellect). He has Greater Spell Penetration, so that's a +16 to CL checks. Realistically it would be a 16th-level caster before running into the big bird, so +16 with no feats - harsh. But +20 with feats and now it's 50/50 - better at level 19.

Given the (seemingly) obvious holes in some builds (a dragon w/o Power Attack? A pure melee machine with Alertness?) I begin to wonder if they are ways the designers used to tone down a creature that was too powerful with optimal feats/skills/spells.

 

[ugulu]

PJS got the post in whilst I composing - glad I looked back - sorry for the wait.

Eieio trundles to 70n50e facing north, unloading with Finger Of Death, Flesh To Stone, Slow, Fear, and Telekinesis (what the heck) along the way.

 

[Gansk]

E-man is shaken by Drum's earlier breath (26 Will save). Drum bites E-man in the retina as he leaves (natural 20, 40-5 crit roll).

E-man takes 39+10 and has 150 hp left. He misses with the fear ray (natural 1).

Drum resists all the other rays except telekinesis. He takes 25 damage from the finger of death and has 322 hp left.

Drum starts round 569.

 

[Evilhalfling]

Drum will trundle forward and to 45n45e and bite at PA 8

 

[PJSlavner]

Ugulu, I think you are right about designers deliberately weakening creatures with useless feats. That does not explain weakening the already weak ocean giant with a bunch of useless ranged attack feats.

Round 569

Drum bites Eieio (rolled 52-8=44) for 19+8=37 points of damage. Eieio has 113 HP remaining.

 

[ugulu]

Eieio meanders to 85n65e5z and turns west so his front arc will come into play. This round's line-up will be Charm Person, Disintegrate, IMW, Finger Of Death, Flesh To Stone, and Slow.