buzzard said:
This is rubbish.
All your rubbish about challenges and putting the onus on the player completely forget that this is merely a game for fun. If it isn't fun, why should he bother? There are other DM's in the world, he should find on more to his taste.
Well if the player is not having fun because of the 20% deal, then its the player that has the problem, and he's still a wimp for leaving for such a minor problem. Its not like there are no ways around it.
Call it what you want, but it IS just a game for fun, the player shouldn't be getting all worked up because his character has to spend an xtra 20%.
How could it not be punishment? The campaign is already heavy on intrigue, and the character is likely as useless in the those situations as the bard is in combat (or moreso in fact). The act of screwing him over on purchases comes across as vindictive. It's not in the rules. It's not done to anyone else. It's not even proportional. How is it not punishment?
Its DM interpretation, which is very much in the rules. Its the number one rule.
It is not punishment, it is simply the end result of the characters situation. It is, at least in the campaign in question, what happens when you have a character with poor charisma and no social skills who tries to make a major purchase. Its a blanket situation. If there were more than one character that fit the criteria in the campaign, I'm sure each one would be treated with the same results. The result of the higher price was not created to repremand the player because he did wrong. Things like that are done because it is felt that its realistic for the scenario. Its a plausable action.
Originally posted by Zappo
Within the rules, "what you deserve" for a low Charisma is a -1 to all social rolls, and that's it. Nothing more. Having all NPCs be automatically unfriendly instead of neutral at the start of an encounter is something new,
Well I don't see the NPCs as reacting unfairly. They are not increasing the price per say... the Player is simply not doing as good a job as a normal, more charismatic, and socially adept person would, in haggling for a good price. Thus that is reflected in the 20% markup. He isn't getting stiffed, he is simply not doing a good job negotiating the transaction.
I could be dismissed as a rules lawyer for arguing that, but the concept is there even if you don't dress it mechanically. The character is suffering the consequences of a failed Charisma check without even rolling. A wizard doesn't automatically miss because he has Strength 8 and a poor BAB.
But he's not missing, he simply isn't performing as well as others.
In any event, whether or not this is specifically written in the rules or not regarding charisma doesn't matter. The art of haggling isn't really addressed in the rules, thus its a point that is
up to DM interpretation.
It is not punishment, and its not the player getting a price hike.
It is the result of poor haggling skills. If the character were better with his social skills, or if the character stuck around and and got to know some of the people, so they would have a chance of looking past his unsocial demeanor, he'd get closer to getting "friend prices." But since he isn't a "friend" and isn't good being social, he doesn't get the "friend prices" and thus pays an additional 20% on transactions that would normally require more than a typical amount of haggling.
Rememer that in situations that are standard haggling, he does fine. He doesn't pay more for standard items, only on items that are beyond standard.
