Cleric - Guardian of Faith

[Naszir]

A friend of mine just relayed this situation to me;

His party entered a room full of zombies, knowing that a very tough fight was ahead of them he suggested the group go back through the door they came, he'd cast Guardian of Faith, they'd close the door, and the zombies would just mindlessly attack the Guardian and eventually all die.

Does a Cleric need to keep a line of sight to the Guardian to maintain it?

As a DM I think, good tactics by the player but I also think that it seems to be a lame way to just crush an encounter.

 

[Syrsuro]

Since it doesn't require a sustain, in the absence of a ruling somewhere to the contrary, I'd say it persists till the encounter ends regardless of line of effect/sight.

However, he can't move it unless he has line of sight/effect.

And the zombie's wouldn't 'attack' the guardian. They wouldn't recognize it as a living object and would probably move to avoid it ('its hurtsss'). So it wouldn't have much effect unless he was there to move it around.

Carl

 

[Naszir]

I don't agree about the zombies moving away. With such a low intelligence the zombies would just keep attacking the guardian in an attempt to kill it so it would stop damaging them. I don't think they would run away, they have no idea if it is a living object or not.

 

[cerberus2112]

My ruling would be quite simple: You ran away, encounter over.

 

[Tale]

Yeah, I don't agree that the zombies would move away. But I don't think they'd try attacking the guardian. Zombies may be stupid, but they don't seek out traps that kill other zombies in an effort to try to make the wall of fire stop burning. Some things are just TOO stupid. They'd only continue if they still could percieve their intended targets on the other side of the door. Which gives rise to a question. Do zombies experience object permanence? Probably.

So... yeah.

 

[dragonchild]

Hmm... I don't know if the zombies would run, but given the flavour text for it I think it wouldn't be unresonable if they did (in theory it might look like a big blazing holy symbol to them). If they did run, you could eventually get the guardian to trap and kill them anyways. Although if I was the DM I'd be tempted to replace the XP for killing the zombies with a smaller reward for having a clever idea that saved the party some trouble (after all, as I understand it, combat XP is based off of risk).

 

[Hypersmurf]

My ruling would be quite simple: You ran away, encounter over.

Sure, but that doesn't mean Guardian of Faith expires - it lasts 'until the end of the encounter', but interestingly, things that last 'until the end of the encounter' don't actually expire when the encounter is over; they expire when you next take a short or extended rest, or after 5 minutes.

So as long as you don't take a rest, the Guardian will continue to attack any zombies who end their turn adjacent to it for five minutes, even if the encounter is over...

PHB p278: Conditional Durations: These effects last until a specified event occurs.
Until the End of the Encounter: The effect ends when you take a rest (short or extended) or after 5 minutes.

-Hyp.

 

[FadedC]

Well the guardian of faith is not a creature and it can't be attacked. The zombies would be no more likely to attack it then they would to attack a wall, a door or a wall of fire (in fat they'd probably be more likely to attack the wall or door because those they could concievably destroy).

There's also little evidence to suggest that 4e zombies are mindless like 3e ones were. They have the same inteligence as an animal, and they have no immunity to sleep, charm, fear or psychic damage. I'd say it's pretty clear that they do have some basic inteligence and can figure out things like "stay away from things that hurt".

 

[On Puget Sound]

If you allow GoF tp be used this way you will never be able to use oozes, constructs, vermin or mindless undead in your game. I don't recommend it.

 

[Syrsuro]

Hmm... I don't know if the zombies would run, but given the flavour text for it I think it wouldn't be unresonable if they did (in theory it might look like a big blazing holy symbol to them). If they did run, you could eventually get the guardian to trap and kill them anyways. Although if I was the DM I'd be tempted to replace the XP for killing the zombies with a smaller reward for having a clever idea that saved the party some trouble (after all, as I understand it, combat XP is based off of risk).

1) How would they trap it - they can't move it if they can't see it (imho). It may persist, but I wouldn't let them trap them.

But that isn't my main point:

2) To repeat your point: "if I was the DM I'd be tempted to replace the XP for killing the zombies with a smaller reward for having a clever idea that saved the party some trouble "

I don't think I have ever seen anything on this board I DISagree with more. You would reduce their experience for having a clever idea that saved them trouble? Reduce?

If anything, they deserve a reward (not that I'm gonna give them that either, aside from the reward of reduced risk).

But reduce experience???

Carl

2)