Cloak of Mage Armor

[cignus_pfaccari]

Bracers of Armor are too expensive for a number of reasons. Take your pick for which to discuss.

Well, given that an Amulet of Natural Armor +5 is 50,000g, and a Bracers of Armor+8 is 64,000g, providing 3 more points of AC for 14,000g, I'm going to say, no, they're not overpriced for what they do.

Expensive? Yes, but what isn't? Consider what you're getting; a Bracers of Armor +n:

- Gives you an armor bonus to your AC without requiring you to wear armor;
- Imposes no Armor Check Penalty or Max Dex, nor does it limit movement or encumberance;
- Protects against incorporeal creatures against whom regular armor is useless (and can be worn AT THE SAME TIME so bonuses overlap as needed); and
- Takes up a slot that has very few other good choices in the DMG (in particular, the Amulet slot, for a monk, has three good choices, all pricey).

There are a few downsides:
- You can't hang special properties on bracers (unless you take the Arms & Equipment Guide option), but there are so few that are worth it this isn't an issue.
- You'll have less total AC per gold spent, but the reason armor's so cheap is that it penalizes movement and skill checks, such that you have to have crazy armor materials and enchants to get something equivalent in benefit. The character types who are likely to have Bracers of Armor as their primary Armor bonus carrier are typically not the type to draw most attacks (arcane casters and monks), so this is not a crippling weakness.

Now, you *can* go ahead and just let your players have their perma-Mage Armor cloak. It's your game, we can't physically stop you. The FASA squads stopped long ago.

Of course, were I in your game, I would then take that same reasoning and make my Gloves of True Strike, using the same reasoning as you give for the cloak, that it's a use-activated continuous magic item, and thus get myself a +20 bonus to hit on every swing.

Brad

 

[Slaved]

Well, given that an Amulet of Natural Armor +5 is 50,000g, and a Bracers of Armor+8 is 64,000g, providing 3 more points of AC for 14,000g, I'm going to say, no, they're not overpriced for what they do.

Mage Armor is a First Level Spell with a 1 Hour Per Caster Level Duration that gives a +4 Force Armor Bonus while the only easily applicable Spell for a Natural Armor Enhancement is a Second Level Spell with a 10 Minutes Per Caster Level Duration.

There are also many cheap ways to gain an Armor Bonus while there are only a handful of ways to gain a Natural Armor Enhancement and they are more expensive.

Although I do think that a Natural Armor Enhancement Bonus should cost less than a Deflection Bonus since the latter is more widely useful.

The benefits you list are of minimal impact in nearly every case where Bracers of Armor would be used. The only important one is that Monks have a problem with wearing actual armor but I do not see how reducing the cost of Bracers of Armor are going to overpower that Class!!!!

Of course, were I in your game, I would then take that same reasoning and make my Gloves of True Strike, using the same reasoning as you give for the cloak, that it's a use-activated continuous magic item, and thus get myself a +20 bonus to hit on every swing.

My reasoning is that there is already a cheap alternative for Bracers of Armor and there is a Long Duration easily accessable spell which covers a large portion of the Bracers range and that the Case of Largest Benefit will be for the Monk who is seen to be very weak in the Armor Class arena already. None of that is applicable to your comment here.

I do not think I would have a problem with a Weapon that took a Standard Action to activate a True Strike Spell which could be used all day long though. One attack every other Round at +20 with the middle Round not being used for anything Offensive is not too bad.

 

[frankthedm]

I do not think I would have a problem with a Weapon that took a Standard Action to activate a True Strike Spell which could be used all day long though. One attack every other Round at +20 with the middle Round not being used for anything Offensive is not too bad.

yes there is once 2 for 1 Power attack comes into play. To say nothing of one-trick-ponies who planned to use that other round to set up thier charge anyway.

 

[Slaved]

yes there is once 2 for 1 Power attack comes into play. To say nothing of one-trick-ponies who planned to use that other round to set up thier charge anyway.

By the time the Characters Base Attack Bonus is high enough for this to be an issue they are giving up Multiple Attacks in order to make a Single Attack more powerful!

Without seeing a build I am unable to comment on the One-Trick-Pony-Charge-Build directly.

 

[WhatGravitas]

yes there is once 2 for 1 Power attack comes into play.

Also: The gloves are nice for rogues. Use your move action to get into flanking position, activate gloves. Next turn: Sneak Attack with greatsword and power attack for hilarious amounts of damage. Because the one thing rogues have problems with is hitting opponents with higher than mid-AC. The gloves get rid of that problem. Throw in something for circumventing armour bonuses as well (e.g. Wraithstrike) and you can do hideous stuff that way.

Mage Armor is a First Level Spell with a 1 Hour Per Caster Level Duration that gives a +4 Force Armor Bonus while the only easily applicable Spell for a Natural Armor Enhancement is a Second Level Spell with a 10 Minutes Per Caster Level Duration.

Don't at it as a spell, look at it as a class feature to offset the pitiful d4. Then the bracers of armour are suddenly items granting class features. Which should be expensive.

Also: If they're overpriced, why they're still competitive? You've listed other alternatives - use them instead, ignoring the bracers. Give your mage a chain shirt. Or just use mage armour.

Cheers, LT.

 

[jaelis]

True strike (3/day) gauntlets cost 3500 gp.

 

[billd91]

except with the longer duration of mage armor, you set your CL high enough and you're only casting in a few times a day, which combat-wise the same as having it always on, what are the odds your 8 hour duration spell expires in the 1 minute of combat that you have ?

With the known strategy of stacking multiple buffs on characters before going into a fight? Much higher than the odds of losing the cloak of armor. Targeting buffed clerics and wizards with dispel magic is a fun and time honored tactic in the campaign I run. That mage armor spell can get dispelled with a blanket casting but, I believe, a particular magic item must be narrowly targeted to be affected.

 

[Slaved]

A
Don't at it as a spell, look at it as a class feature to offset the pitiful d4. Then the bracers of armour are suddenly items granting class features. Which should be expensive.

Also: If they're overpriced, why they're still competitive? You've listed other alternatives - use them instead, ignoring the bracers. Give your mage a chain shirt. Or just use mage armour.

Cheers, LT.

What? The Classes with d4 for Hit Dice are those that can already use the Spell so have little need for the Bracers of Armor. What Class Feature is being gained? Why not look at the item in reference to a Common Spell in the Core Rules?

What makes you think that they are competitive? The only Class that might really want them is the Monk and that Class DOES NOT need yet another overpriced item to get a basic effect!!!!

 

[gabriel_z]

The skeptic in me would be more likely to guess that you wanted a +4 armor bonus without paying the full cost of the bracers at that level.
QUOTE]

No, I started the debate with something simple! I wanted to add a continuos "shield" spell as well.

 

[Folly]

The problem here stems from the equation for magic items that emulate spells. This equation is horribly inadequate at estimating the price of the item. There are numerous examples were this equation cause items to be either under-priced or over-priced.

Your question is a special exception since there is an existing item that already provided the base affect. Adding the cost of a second effect has an extra 50% attach to every effect except for the most expensive one. So if you where to use the equation to determine the cost of shield, it would be 1 spell level*1 caster level*2000 base coefficient *2 duration coefficient = 4000gp for the shield aspect. For a +4 armor (not discussing what it should be worth) cost 16000. This means that combining them would cost 22000, since 16000 for the armor and 6000 for the shield (because of the 50% extra cost). I personally wouldn't go for this item as the DM, since it would seem to me that if an armor bonus has a cost of 16000 for a +4, shield should cost about the same.