Coming in May: Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes! [UPDATED!]

So they just gave the title and showed the cover mock-ups; no specific info till Monday?

 

[QuietBrowser]

Just wanted to get a few things off of my chest now that I finally caught up on the end of the thread.

Firstly, I am really, really disappointed that after the wonderful "End of Human Domination" design angle they had in 4e, they have explicitly turned their back on it and returned to suckling from that dry and withered teat.

Secondly, Planescape Eladrin as a higher-ranked, more magically powerful form of the "mystical elf" Eladrin PC race is not unique to 5e, it's actually how they were handled in 4e - Ghaele, Bralani, Coure and all the rest were different esoteric ranks of nobility and authority within the Court of Stars. In fact, the very first 4e Monster Manual had the Bralani of Autumn Winds and the Ghaele of Winter as enemies, with the Coure of Mischief & Strife appearing in the MM2.

Finally, I'm not hugely fussed on Shadar-kai reverting to being a fey race because it seems like a cheap way to cheat them out of having their actual shadow-melding and other unique racial powers, but I can enjoy it when I think on how this inadvertently gives a huge middle finger to old-school lore that elves never, ever get involved in necromancy or anything relating to it.

 

[Parmandur]

Just wanted to get a few things off of my chest now that I finally caught up on the end of the thread.

Firstly, I am really, really disappointed that after the wonderful "End of Human Domination" design angle they had in 4e, they have explicitly turned their back on it and returned to suckling from that dry and withered teat.

Secondly, Planescape Eladrin as a higher-ranked, more magically powerful form of the "mystical elf" Eladrin PC race is not unique to 5e, it's actually how they were handled in 4e - Ghaele, Bralani, Coure and all the rest were different esoteric ranks of nobility and authority within the Court of Stars. In fact, the very first 4e Monster Manual had the Bralani of Autumn Winds and the Ghaele of Winter as enemies, with the Coure of Mischief & Strife appearing in the MM2.

Finally, I'm not hugely fussed on Shadar-kai reverting to being a fey race because it seems like a cheap way to cheat them out of having their actual shadow-melding and other unique racial powers, but I can enjoy it when I think on how this inadvertently gives a huge middle finger to old-school lore that elves never, ever get involved in necromancy or anything relating to it.

Most PCs are Human or Half-Elf, and most fantasy is human-centric: abandoning a losing financial strategy is just good business.

 

[Olive]

Interesting perpective. How do you feel about the 3e Forgotten Realms Cosmology and Eberrons Cosmology for planar adventures instead of the great wheel?

I use a vague hack of the 3e FR cosmology for my games. I never really liked the Great Wheel as it tied too closely to alignment which has never been anything more than a guide for us.

Edit: What was up with my spelling?

 

[Jester David]

Okay, I know that this is really himing in far too late, but I needed to challenge this:

The Blood War as never "over" in 4th edition. It was still around. There were a grand total of four changes; three to the Blood War itself, and one to how the planar sourcebooks were written.

Firstly, the Blood War stopped being the Big Blatant Plothook - Planescape splats could hardly go a page of flavor without talking about the Blood War, whilst in 4e, planar sourcebooks actually talked about things other than the Blood War. It was still there, it just wasn't the all-devouring plotline it was in AD&D.

As for the Blood War's changes... Firstly, it had a hot & cold cycle; in the "hot" phrase, you have armies of trillions upon trillions of fiends and damned souls battling across the planes to mutual extinction, and then, in the "cold" phase, you have them retreat to lick their wounds, replenish their numbers, rebuild their fortifications and plan out for the next grand scale onslaught. Secondly, Good was no longer made to look impotent in the face of the Blood War. And finally, the Blood War's root cause changed from a clumsy Moorcockian Evil Law vs. Evil Chaos affair to a more readily understandable battle over the Heart of the Abyss and the potential to claim the entire multiverse and reshape it to their desired form.

The February 1st Dragon Talk goes into it quite a bit and justifies the evil vs evil feud nicely without going into Moorcockian law vs chaos per se...

 

[Charlaquin]

Just wanted to get a few things off of my chest now that I finally caught up on the end of the thread.

Firstly, I am really, really disappointed that after the wonderful "End of Human Domination" design angle they had in 4e, they have explicitly turned their back on it and returned to suckling from that dry and withered teat.

What else is new? 5e is threw out every last drop of 4e’s perfectly good bathwater with that ugly ass baby. It sucks, but it seems to be working for them. At least this particular good idea that got abandoned because screw 4e is purely setting and can easily be put back into the game.

Secondly, Planescape Eladrin as a higher-ranked, more magically powerful form of the "mystical elf" Eladrin PC race is not unique to 5e, it's actually how they were handled in 4e - Ghaele, Bralani, Coure and all the rest were different esoteric ranks of nobility and authority within the Court of Stars. In fact, the very first 4e Monster Manual had the Bralani of Autumn Winds and the Ghaele of Winter as enemies, with the Coure of Mischief & Strife appearing in the MM2.

Yep.

Finally, I'm not hugely fussed on Shadar-kai reverting to being a fey race because it seems like a cheap way to cheat them out of having their actual shadow-melding and other unique racial powers, but I can enjoy it when I think on how this inadvertently gives a huge middle finger to old-school lore that elves never, ever get involved in necromancy or anything relating to it.

I’m not familiar with this particular bit of old school lore, given that Baelnorn were a thing. But, I agree that Shadar-Kai being Elves now doesn’t particularly bother me. I’d prefer them to be their own race entirely rather than a subrace of anything, but eh. At least we’ve still got Tieflings, and if the UA subraces make it in, they could each be descended from a different Turathi house.

 

[Quickleaf]

Looking at the picture again, looking at what the bat winged woman is wearing, there is no way she is Glasya, Fierna, or Malcanthet. So a Cambion variant is most likely.

Hordlings sound like an interesting choice, expanding the fiendish races.

https://i.imgur.com/fhpBm7M_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

Actually, it could very well be Malcanthet, just a twist on her classic artistic depictions.

Not too far of a leap from those to this...

 

[Shasarak]

In the end... what I want out of a planar setting is far closer to Planescape: Torment - the game where you midwife a pregnant street, traverse the subterranean streets of a necropolis full of civilized undead, interact with the prostitutes at an intellectualistic brothel, and explore a fortress built from crystalized regret, all with the aid of a wisecracking skull, a fiend-blooded street urchin, an alien warrior-wizard with a deep secular religion, a chaste succubus, and Nordom. I want the kind of setting where I can truly embrace the wonders and weirdness of the multiverse. The kind of setting where a party comprised of a prime-worlder androgynous black mage trying to reshape his destiny, a half-marilith gnoll who is one of Yeenoghu's abandoned daughters, a duthka'gith out to free her people from Vlaakith CLVII's slavery, a tanuki ninja and the faerie dragon equivalent of a kobold would not attract more than a few stares.

I may not exactly agree with your conclusion but those images really put the Yeah back into Planescape for sure.

 

[Sadras]

This book is exactly what I'm currently needing for where my high level campaign is at.
I for one am happy!

 

[Herosmith14]

https://i.imgur.com/fhpBm7M_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

Actually, it could very well be Malcanthet, just a twist on her classic artistic depictions.

Not too far of a leap from those to this...

I may be wrong about this (still new to DND, don't k ow any past edition lore) but the cover person looks like an Erinyes to me. I know they typically have angel wings, but other than that, I would think it's a deva-turned-devil.


Sent from my iPhone using EN World mobile app

 

[gyor]

https://i.imgur.com/fhpBm7M_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&fidelity=medium

Actually, it could very well be Malcanthet, just a twist on her classic artistic depictions.

Not too far of a leap from those to this...

Yeah, it appears it could be Malcanthet, I hope it is.