D&D 5E Conjure Fey -- Super Disappointing

[pming]

Hiya!

Breaking News!

Unconfirmed sources have indicated that most of the spells under the Conjure... title, such as Fey, Celestials, etc., list ONLY the CR that the caster can choose. This hints heavily, if not outright, that the caster of the spell doesn't control what is actually conjured, leaving it up to the DM to decide! Dungeon Masters are known for creating all manner of beasties for their hapless player's character's to encounter in the campaign world, so I'm sure that any DM worth his/her salt will have a creature for every CR available. Updates to the story to come!



Seriously...the player doesn't get to pick the creature as far as Conjure Fey is concerned. All the player has to do is say "I conjure a CR 5 Fey"...it's up to the DM to decide on an appropriate creature. Of course, d-headed DM's can/will screw players with this...but if you are a player with a d-head of a DM...what to F do you expect?! Go play with a better DM! (or become one yourself and do it the "right" way).

^_^

Paul L. Ming

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

Of course the caster only gets to determine the CR. But if I attempt to conjure a CR 3 Green Hag via Conjure Fey because that's about as good as I can get, and my DM chooses to give me a CR 6 Grey Nisp from Fifth Edition Foes or another CR 6 homebrew of his own creation, am I going to be upset? No way! That's even better than I was expecting!

I'd be upset if he gave me a CR 1 useless enchanted dragonfly homebrew, but since that would be a jerk move on his part let's just assume he wouldn't do that, because I wouldn't do that if I were DMing. And even if he did, you'd just re-cast Conjure Fey tomorrow instead until you got something worth keeping, instead of Planar Binding the useless dragonfly.

Besides, Enworld posters are mostly DMs anyway, so you can safely assume we are exploring the boundaries of what is reasonably possible out of the box.

 

[LoreMaps]

Hiya!

Breaking News!

Unconfirmed sources have indicated that most of the spells under the Conjure... title, such as Fey, Celestials, etc., list ONLY the CR that the caster can choose. This hints heavily, if not outright, that the caster of the spell doesn't control what is actually conjured, leaving it up to the DM to decide! Dungeon Masters are known for creating all manner of beasties for their hapless player's character's to encounter in the campaign world, so I'm sure that any DM worth his/her salt will have a creature for every CR available. Updates to the story to come!



Seriously...the player doesn't get to pick the creature as far as Conjure Fey is concerned. All the player has to do is say "I conjure a CR 5 Fey"...it's up to the DM to decide on an appropriate creature. Of course, d-headed DM's can/will screw players with this...but if you are a player with a d-head of a DM...what to F do you expect?! Go play with a better DM! (or become one yourself and do it the "right" way).

^_^

Paul L. Ming

This is very interesting! Thanks for sharing!

 

[jaelis]

Unconfirmed sources have indicated that most of the spells under the Conjure... title, such as Fey, Celestials, etc., list ONLY the CR that the caster can choose.

Well, it's confirmed in the sense that it is in the Sage Advice column...

When you cast a spell like conjure woodland beings, does the spellcaster or the DM choose the creatures that are conjured? A number of spells in the game let you summon creatures. Conjure animals, conjure celestial, conjure minor elementals, and conjure woodland beings are just a few examples.

Some spells of this sort specify that the spellcaster chooses the creature conjured. For example, find familiar gives the caster a list of animals to choose from.

Other spells of this sort let the spellcaster choose from among several broad options. For example, conjure minor elementals offers four options. Here are the first two:
• One elemental of challenge rating 2 or lower
• Two elementals of challenge rating 1 or lower
The design intent for options like these is that the spellcaster chooses one of them, and then the DM decides what creatures appear that fit the chosen option. For example, if you pick the second option, the DM chooses the two elementals that have a challenge rating of 1 or lower.

A spellcaster can certainly express a preference for what creatures shows up, but it’s up to the DM to determine if they do. The DM will often choose creatures that are appropriate for the campaign and that will be fun to introduce in a scene.

 

[ExploderWizard]

Alas, poor Conjure Fey.

It allows you to conjure a fey creature (or beast) up to CR 6.

And the highest CR Fey we have in the MM is the Green Hag at CR 3 and the only CR 6 beast (Fey spirit, per the spell) is the Mammoth.

Seems a little disappointing to me. We need some Sidhe, stat!

While there are CR ranges that aren't well represented, all you ever really need with this spell are 8 pixies and you are good to go.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

While there are CR ranges that aren't well represented, all you ever really need with this spell are 8 pixies and you are good to go.

Assuming that your DM has CR 1/4 pixies like the MM. At my table, Pixies are CR 1, just like Dryads. You can (potentially) get two of them with Conjure Woodland Creatures IV, or six of them with VIII.

 

[ExploderWizard]

Assuming that your DM has CR 1/4 pixies like the MM. At my table, Pixies are CR 1, just like Dryads. You can (potentially) get two of them with Conjure Woodland Creatures IV, or six of them with VIII.

Pixes do make more sense as a higher level CR based on their spell powers.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

Pixes do make more sense as a higher level CR based on their spell powers.

Precisely. The Conjure Woodland Creatures cheese is one symptom, but the root cause is the bad CR. If you fix only one symptom instead of the root cause, you leave the other symptoms intact. E.g. 5 kobolds and 2 (evil) pixies is not a Medium encounter for four 2nd level characters. The Pixies will hit the PCs with Sleep and Confusion while the kobolds tear them to shreds.

Change pixies to CR 1 and it becomes Deadly x1.5, which is a little bit more inline with reality. (Even though the CR system has problems as a whole.)