Considering some House Rules

With regards to the charge rule:
1. 'Charging requires that you move at least 1 square from your starting square instead of 2 squares'

Why: When only allowed a standard action (because of daze or having to stand up from prone), you may attack if you are 0 squares or 2+ squares away, but not when at exactly 1 square. Abilities which push several squares and knockdown are often optimal when they leave a target exactly 1 away. Again, non-intuitive and exploitable.

I would change it to:

Charging normally requires you to move at least two squares to gain the benefit from charging (+1 to attack or bull rush). You can charge by moving only one square, but you do not gain any benefit to your attack or bull rush by doing so.

This would allow them to attack and remove the (certainly illogical and hopefully unintentional) 1 square limitation. But I wouldn't go so far as to simply remove the two square limit under normal circumstances however.

Re: Daze and Stun

4. Daze or stun can become "no fun", at least on important creatures:
PCs, Elite, and Solo creatures may remove a stun or daze effect at any time by spending an action point. If any of these creatures is dazed or stunned at the end of its turn after making any saves, it may choose to become Immune to the appropriate condition for the encounter in exchange for acquiring a vulnerability 5 (10 at paragon, 15 at epic) to any attack that carries the condition.

If I were to go for a houserule on this subject, I would just take the much simpler (and weaker) approach and allow them to spend an action point to get a free save. Sure, they only break the effect 50% of the time, but they don't have to worry about the vulnerability either. But my more likely approach is described below.

re: Minions

I had already decided that I wasn't 100% happy with minions as written. And the most obvious and simplest fix was to allow for them to become bloodied (still no need to track hp so you don't give up the greatest benefit and it adds alot to the combat). The approach I use is as follows. Attacks that miss (and still do damage) or attacks that do less than a threshold value (still in testing, currently 3+level) only bloody rather than kill the minion. Any damage to a bloodied minion kills it and any critical hit kills a minion.

The other rules I don't think I would use, although I am considering some approach to allow for more magic item uses now that the party is starting to have a few. I'll take your rule under advisement but doubt I will implement it as written.

On a related subject - the rule I am considering but haven't tried yet is (note: this is loosely based on a blog post here: Heroic Effort | A Butterfly Dreaming )

On any attack roll, saving throw or skill check a player may choose to spend an action point on a 'heroic effort'. On this attack, the player rolls his normal die and an extra die (and must distinguish which is which - I may use one of my own dice for the heroic die). If the normal die misses, he may use the heroic die instead, however he cannot critical with the heroic die (a natural 20 is treated the same as any other number and carries no special benefits, such as a critical). Abilities which allow a die to be rerolled may not be used on the heroic die.

The goal of this is to allow players to try to avoid missing those all important dailies, if they wish. Or ensure that sneak attack hits when they really need a hit. Or make sure they don't fail that third death save - this round, at least. Etc. But it doesn't allow them to (for example) ignore a hit on their main die to score a critical off of the heroic die. I feel it is balanced because they are, in essence, giving up a potential attack (the action point) for a bonus on one attack.

Carl
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Let me say this: I don't think it's bad that there are reasons to sometimes your powers to less than their maximum value. Rather, I think it's the sign of a decent tactical game.

D&D4e is theoretically designed so that someone won't gimp themselves via poor math. This is an example where the way things actually work goes at odds with how a normal person would understand the situation. Think about it from a design space for a moment:

0 squares = may use any of your attacks normally
1 square = no melee options whatsoever
2 squares = may charge making a restricted attack
...
6 squares = may charge making a restricted attack
7 squares = too far, can't charge

So, it's an advantage to be closer... except at 1. 1 is bad. 1 is a dead zone. Monsters should move 1 square from dazed or prone characters, prone and push X should be reduced to 1, etc. If that's a design feature, it's really not in line with the way they've designed the rest of the system.

Dunno if I'd call getting Illusory Ambush at-will as less powerful than Burning Hands (or any of the other 1st level Encounter powers). The at-will is going to be useful in a lot more situations.

Amusingly, there are objections that at-wills are better than encounters and encounters are better than dailies in this same thread, so I think I'll have to go into analysis on this one more extensively when I have free time.

Anyway, there's nothing at all wrong with changing the meta-game dynamics like you're proposing. IMHO it's very important to know what you're changing, and then choose the changes that implement the game as you want it to play.

Fair. Honestly I'm not wicked attached to it (or really any of them), but it's one possible way to address the milestone concept (which seems to bother some people) and 5-minute day / alpha striking (which bothers some people, often different ones) so figured I'd write it down.
 

Re: Daze and Stun

If I were to go for a houserule on this subject, I would just take the much simpler (and weaker) approach and allow them to spend an action point to get a free save. Sure, they only break the effect 50% of the time, but they don't have to worry about the vulnerability either. But my more likely approach is described below.
It's not a 50% chance - it doesn't help a lot with good stun-locks, i.e. a high-wisdom orb wizard dropping a stun spell on the target.

Cheers, LT.
 

D&D4e is theoretically designed so that someone won't gimp themselves via poor math. This is an example where the way things actually work goes at odds with how a normal person would understand the situation. Think about it from a design space for a moment:

0 squares = may use any of your attacks normally
1 square = no melee options whatsoever
2 squares = may charge making a restricted attack
...
6 squares = may charge making a restricted attack
7 squares = too far, can't charge

So, it's an advantage to be closer... except at 1. 1 is bad. 1 is a dead zone. Monsters should move 1 square from dazed or prone characters, prone and push X should be reduced to 1, etc. If that's a design feature, it's really not in line with the way they've designed the rest of the system.
Not if you consider the effect of Reach weapons, and how they were 'nerfed' in 4e (by separating out Threatening Reach). The glaive dude has a situational bonus that his maul or longsword using companions lack.

Amusingly, there are objections that at-wills are better than encounters and encounters are better than dailies in this same thread, so I think I'll have to go into analysis on this one more extensively when I have free time.
Well, I don't know if I'd say they're actually better. I'd rather have any one of several Encounter powers usable at-will than have a bonus Illusory Ambush. However, getting a power as good as Illusory Ambush usable at-will may be better than getting any 1st level Encounter power usable per encounter. (This is why Humans make such great Wizards, IMHO. Wizards have enough distinct At-Will powers that the extra power really matters.)

Fair. Honestly I'm not wicked attached to it (or really any of them), but it's one possible way to address the milestone concept (which seems to bother some people) and 5-minute day / alpha striking (which bothers some people, often different ones) so figured I'd write it down.
Sure. In my experience (limited to my group, of course), merely enabling the PCs to keep trucking has been enough to remove the alpha-strike syndrome that 3.5e so strongly encouraged. Since it hasn't been a problem for us, I tend to look at solutions with an eye towards unanticipated downside.

You might want to look at how some high-level magic items already work -- like most rings, IIRC -- which grant a bigger benefit if you've hit a Milestone. There are all sorts of cool ways to work that into the flavor of the items, too -- "Stormblinger's purple blade glows with pimptastic orange runes as it drinks in the blood of your fallen foes!" -- or something like that.

Cheers, -- N
 

Yeah, I actually wish more milestone effects worked like that. :) Outside of LFR, many players seem quite confused by milestones and daily item uses so I was hoping to throw a couple pokes at them.
 

It's not a 50% chance - it doesn't help a lot with good stun-locks, i.e. a high-wisdom orb wizard dropping a stun spell on the target.

Cheers, LT.

Only relevant if you have NPCs stun locking the PCs alot, since we are talking about a house rule that will almost exclusively be used by the PCs.

Carl
 

Oops, copy-paste didn't actually get all the rules - it missed the first one I did and I didn't realize.

So... 7) 'Penalties for failed saves only trigger on saving throws made at the end of your turn. For purposes of "Failed Save" "First Failed Save" "Second Failed Save" or any similar mechanic, extra saves (such as from an item or power) are ignored completely.'
Example: A beholder hits Regdar with its petrifying ray. Jozan uses his sacred flame ability to give Regdar a saving throw, which Regdar fails. At the end of his turn, Regdar again fails his saving throw, which means that he triggers the "First Failed Save" penalty of becoming immobilized.

Why: Abilities which give extra saves can be penalties, such as hobgoblins falling asleep immediately or sacred flame getting Regdar petrified. This is non-intuitive and a potential trap for DMs and players.
 

Pets & Sidekicks

Remove ads

Top