Converting original D&D and Mystara monsters

[Shade]

Once we've settled on the Huge-size adjustments, I'd like to argue about the windstorm and waterblast special attack I proposed earlier.

Do any of the sample Mystaran gargantuas have such powers?

How about making colossal creatures with this template applied Colossal+?

They already are.

If you check my Working Draft you'll see any base creature of Huge or greater size becomes a Colossal+ gargantua.

Updated Homebrews.

Rather than set a specific size, I added a note to simply increase the space reach for already Colossal creatures. This avoids any issues where a creature might actually get smaller (Colossal allows a great variance in Space/Reach).

Cleon -- Now that Homebrews is (mostly) caught up, please avoid updating your working draft to avoid confusion. Just let me know what changes need to be made to Homebrews. Thanks!

 

[Mortis]

Do any of the sample Mystaran gargantuas have such powers?

No - but then again it was supposed to be a 'simpler' system.

And we've got to give Cleon something after taking away his 'Large' option.

Regards
Mortis

 

[Cleon]

Do any of the sample Mystaran gargantuas have such powers?

There isn't any precedent for windstorm, but there's a "Gargantua" in AC9 with a water-blast breath weapon. It's listed in the index as "Gargantua, Carp", so I think it qualifies.

Rather than set a specific size, I added a note to simply increase the space reach for already Colossal creatures. This avoids any issues where a creature might actually get smaller (Colossal allows a great variance in Space/Reach).

The basic approach is good, although I fancy retaining the three size step increase.

e.g.:

Mystaran Gargantua Size Table
Base Size. . . New Size . Space/Reach (tall) . Space/Reach (long)
Fine to Small . Huge . . . 15 ft./15 ft . . 15 ft./10 ft.
Medium . . . Gargantuan .. 20 ft./20 ft . . 20 ft./15 ft.
Large . . . . Colossal . . 30 ft./30 ft . . 30 ft./20 ft.
Huge . .. . . Colossal . . 40 ft./40 ft . . 40 ft./30 ft.
Gargantuan .. Colossal . . 50 ft./50 ft . . 50 ft./40 ft.
Colossal . .. Colossal .. +30 ft./+30 ft . +30 ft./+20 ft.*
*If the base creature is Colossal, increase its Space by 30 ft. and increase its Reach by 30 ft. (for tall) or 20 ft. (for long).

Hmm... I think I prefer that to the current Homebrew version.

Cleon -- Now that Homebrews is (mostly) caught up, please avoid updating your working draft to avoid confusion. Just let me know what changes need to be made to Homebrews. Thanks!

Don't worry, I intended to stop updating it once the Homebrew's up.

I'm plotting all new methods for confusing you.

 

[freyar]

I think the waterblast was based on the gargantua carp. Was the windblast just from Hover? I could see adding those, but only for "appropriate" critters (say, aquatic ones and ones with wings).

 

[Shade]

There isn't any precedent for windstorm, but there's a "Gargantua" in AC9 with a water-blast breath weapon. It's listed in the index as "Gargantua, Carp", so I think it qualifies.

Since most of the Mystaran gargantua didn't gain additional powers, let's add this as an underbar. Something like "Additional Gargantua Powers" with an associated CR increase.

The basic approach is good, although I fancy retaining the three size step increase.
Colossal . .. Colossal .. +30 ft./+30 ft . +30 ft./+20 ft.*
If the base creature is Colossal, increase its Space by 30 ft. and increase its Reach by 30 ft. (for tall) or 20 ft. (for long).

That works for me. I just want to avoid the largely unnecessary "size that isn't a size" Colossal+.

Don't worry, I intended to stop updating it once the Homebrew's up.

I'm plotting all new methods for confusing you.

<braces self>

 

[freyar]

Well, I'm confused enough. What remains on these?

 

[Mortis]

Well, I'm confused enough. What remains on these?

Description - which will obviously be based on the original creature.

Organisation - I agree with Solitary. There may be more at Immortal/Epic level though.

CR

and of course some examples - Should we stick to the examples in the Master/Immortal rules?

Regards
Mortis

 

[Shade]

We should work up the samples first to determine the CR adjustment, and yes to using the Master/Immortal sample monsters again here.

 

[Cleon]

Since most of the Mystaran gargantua didn't gain additional powers, let's add this as an underbar. Something like "Additional Gargantua Powers" with an associated CR increase.

That works for me.

I was basically thinking land creatures get trample, aquatic creatures get waterblast, flyers get windblast.

 

[Cleon]

Description - which will obviously be based on the original creature.

Organisation - I agree with Solitary. There may be more at Immortal/Epic level though.

Going by the original description it should be solitary with a note they congregate in numbers around "The Tower of Gargantua".

CR

I'm thinking of using the following table:

Old CR . . . New CR
up to 1/4 . . CR 5
1/3 or 1/2 .. CR 6
. . 1 . . . . CR 8
. . 2 . . . . CR 10
. . 3 . . . . CR 13
. . 4 . . . . CR 16
. . 5 . . . . CR 18
. . 6 . . . . CR 21
. . 7 . . . . CR 24
each +1 . . . CR +3

It seems to work OK, but I'd like to do some examples before settling on it.

and of course some examples - Should we stick to the examples in the Master/Immortal rules?

We can't use a Carrion Crawler, since that's product identity, but I'm looking forward to a Gargantua Troll and a Gargantua Gargoyle.

I think we should also do a Vermin and an Animal. Maybe a Small Monstrous Spider and a Rat?

A spider will allow us to see how the area-effect and poison boosting works out, and a Rat seems a likely subject for "early experimentation".

Four examples would probably do, unless you fancy a Magical Beast as well?