Could Arcane Recovery be the link between Mage.

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
There really aren't really class features between the Mage classes they share in mechanics or style. All the Sorcerer, Warlock, Wizard and other perspective mages classes share is Full Spellcasting and access to Arcane Spells. Since Bards have the same things, the mages might need something else to share to link them.

So here is my guess: Arcane Recovery

Arcane Recovery: Sorcery
At the 2nd level, you have learned to regain some of your magical energy by tapping into your supernatural blood. When you finish a short rest, you can choose expended sorcery points to recover. The amount of sorcerer points is equal to your half your sorcerer level (rounded up). Once you regain sorcery points with this feature, you must finish a long rest before you can do so again.

At the 8th level, you can do use your Arcane Recovery twice a day. At the 16th level you can do it three times a day.

Arcane Recovery: Eldritch Savant
At the 2nd level, you have learned to regain some of your magical energy by drawing on your pact. Once per day as a Magic action, you can recover one expended spell slots from your Pact Magic feature. Once you regain a spell slot with this feature, you must finish a long rest before you can do so again.

Arcane Recovery: Eldritch Master
At 20th level, you can draw on your inner reserve of mystical power while entreating your patron to regain expended spell slots. You can spend 1 minute entreating your patron for aid to regain all your expended spell slots from your Pact Magic feature. Once you regain spell slots with this feature, you must finish a long rest before you can do so again.


Arcane Recovery: Wizardry
At the 2nd level, you have learned to regain some of your magical energy by studying your spellbook. When you finish a short rest, you can choose expended spell slots to recover. The spell slots can have a combined level that is equal to or less than half your wizard level (rounded up), and none of the slots can be 6th level or higher. Once you regain spell slots with this feature, you must finish a long rest before you can do so again.

For example, if you’re a 4th-level wizard, you can recover up to two levels worth of spell slots. You can recover either a 2nd-level spell slot or two 1st-level spell slots.

Why?
  1. Wizards already has it
  2. Warlocks already sort of has it in Eldritch Master
  3. People already complain that Sorcerers don't have enough sorcery points.
  4. Easy to learn
  5. Already Multiclass proof as they are based on class level
  6. Easy to tie Subclasses.
Thoughts? Think it will Arcane mastery? Or Something else?
 

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aco175

Legend
I can see it as everyone likes to cast spells and now you would get some back. It would encourage and 10 minute workday.
 

I can see it as everyone likes to cast spells and now you would get some back. It would encourage and 10 minute workday.
Taking an hour to get your spells back instead of 8 hours is the opposite of encouraging the 10 minute workday though. If you can get them back, you don't have to call it a night after every encounter.
 

aco175

Legend
Taking an hour to get your spells back instead of 8 hours is the opposite of encouraging the 10 minute workday though. If you can get them back, you don't have to call it a night after every encounter.
I was thinking that if you get some spells back, you get to have two- 5 minute workdays before you rest. It was more of a joke.
 

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
I still don't understand why sorcerer exsist. Especially since they now use the exact same spell list.

Just pick Int or Cha at level 1.

The add some meta magic options, such as evoker can use careful metamagic with spending points. Ect..

Otherwise, I think forcing them to spread their spells out over a day a bit more wouldn't be a bad thing.
Sorcerer represent the real world classic spellcaster. The one with limited spells but more mastery of those spells.
They are the mage of history that only knew dragon spells or fire spells or mind control. But they do a lot with those spells.

Wizard represent the magic scholar. The wizard knows a lot of spells but cannot alter them well. They can know a wide range of spells and learn other spells from other wizards.

Plus we learned form 3rd edition, having a spellbook and full metamagic was broken.
 

I am sure it will be something like arcane recovery, but in the interest of contemplating interesting options: they could be to make metamagic a mage thing (and give sorcerers access to special metamagic that takes sorcery points). Or they could have some kind of special potion skill: wizards have detailed cookbooks, warlocks get access to "magic YouTube" so they can watch their patrons, and sorcerers cook by feel. Finally, they could make some kind of magic dueling ability specific to each class, maybe sorcerers can automatically know the level of spells being cast in their vicinity, so they can counterspell without having to take an action to figure out the level, warlocks can summon some sneaky critter that can shoot their enemy in the back in the duel, and I haven't figure out what wizards get, yet.
 

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
I can see it as everyone likes to cast spells and now you would get some back. It would encourage and 10 minute workday.
Technically it would be 2 hour workday since you need a to spend an hour short resting.

Outside of a dugeon, 2 hours is at least something a DM can work with.
 

mellored

Hero
Sorcerer represent the real world classic spellcaster.
Real world spell casters??
The one with limited spells but more mastery of those spells.
They are the mage of history that only knew dragon spells or fire spells or mind control. But they do a lot with those spells.
Those are psionics.

You get fire, and a bunch of points to spend using it in different ways.
Wizard represent the magic scholar. The wizard knows a lot of spells but cannot alter them well. They can know a wide range of spells and learn other spells from other wizards.
I bet you could play a sorcerer, call yourself a wizard, and fool most people for most of the game. Or vice-versa.
 

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
Real world spell casters??
I mean spellcaster of real world myth and religion.

There's no such thing as real spellcasters :oops::whistle::cool:

Those are psionics.

You get fire, and a bunch of points to spend using it in different ways.
Eeeeeh
D&D kinda give psionics its own set of magic different from Arcane.
In 3rd edition there were different classes for this, one for each spell list:
  1. Favored Soul
  2. Spirit Shaman
  3. Sorcerer
  4. Wilder
I bet you could play a sorcerer, call yourself a wizard, and fool most people for most of the game. Or vice-versa.
Sure until you start casting spells.
Then your lack of versatility will shines.
Anyway the sorcerer isn't disappearing from D&D in this or future editions.
 

mellored

Hero
D&D kinda give psionics its own set of magic different from Arcane.
Exactly.
Psionics is different.
Arcane spell slot caster is the same.
Sure until you start casting spells.
Then your lack of versatility will shines.
Pretty sure you won't see someone casting fireball twice per day and think "that's obviously a sorcerer not a wizard".

Also, an aberrant mind sorcerer will know more spells than a wizard. And everyone is getting rituals. And they have the exact same number of slots at the same levels.

So I'm not sure what versatility your really talking about.
Anyway the sorcerer isn't disappearing from D&D in this or future editions.
Well probably not from this one.
But hopefully future ones.

Or have the sorcerer use spell points instead of slots or something that is actually different.

Anyways. I'm still good for wizards having a little more short rest abilities, and a bit less daily.
 

I still don't understand why sorcerer exsist. Especially since they now use the exact same spell list.

Just pick Int or Cha at level 1.

The add some meta magic options, such as evoker can use careful metamagic with spending points. Ect..

Otherwise, I think forcing them to spread their spells out over a day a bit more wouldn't be a bad thing.
Not just sorcerer at this point. Bard too. And if warlock loses pact magic throw it into the pile. Why do we need three/four full casters using identical spell lists, with just slightly different levelling progression features. Isn't that literally what a subclass is?

But for some reason a support martial and an arcane half caster are not unique enough to be their own classes?

Imo there needs to be a 4th magic source (pathfinder calls it occult) for Bards. They should not just be a wizard with a guitar.
 

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
Exactly.
Psionics is different.
Arcane spell slot caster is the same.
I mean different effects.

Arcane and Psionics have different effects. Some sorts of sorcerer magic like thunder magic, fate magic,, dragon, alignment, and wild magic don't mage sense as Psionics.

D&D's Arcane mage has that link to being a list of various disconnected phenomena under 9 schools. Whereas D&D Psionics is more limited and linked harder to their 5-6 disciplines
 

I still don't understand why sorcerer exsist. Especially since they now use the exact same spell list.

Just pick Int or Cha at level 1.

The add some meta magic options, such as evoker can use careful metamagic with spending points. Ect..

Otherwise, I think forcing them to spread their spells out over a day a bit more wouldn't be a bad thing.

We don't know what will seperate them in 2 or 3 month..
 


Fair.

And actually, if they just improved the slot <-> point conversation, they could effectively be a spell point caster. And that would be different.

Probably still want to recover some points on a short rest recovery too.

Or just make them spell point casters to begin with. And then add the conversion rate to the multiclass rules.
 

I still don't understand why sorcerer exsist. Especially since they now use the exact same spell list.

Just pick Int or Cha at level 1.

The add some meta magic options, such as evoker can use careful metamagic with spending points. Ect..

Otherwise, I think forcing them to spread their spells out over a day a bit more wouldn't be a bad thing.

They haven't released the Sorcerer so we won't know until they do, but I suspect they will still have sorcery points. Sorcerer's might be spell school restricted like no Necromancy spells, but with subclass spell lists.

I think Warlocks will retain Pact Magic, but it'll be adjusted.
 

I still don't understand why sorcerer exsist. Especially since they now use the exact same spell list.

Just pick Int or Cha at level 1.

The add some meta magic options, such as evoker can use careful metamagic with spending points. Ect..

Otherwise, I think forcing them to spread their spells out over a day a bit more wouldn't be a bad thing.
I mean, if we'd actually got the sorcerer from the original 5e playtest, it would certainly have a reason to exist. That class is completely unique compared to every single class and subclass available in 5e today.
 

JohnSnow

Hero
I still don't understand why sorcerer exsist. Especially since they now use the exact same spell list.
Sorcerers exist because some people hate Vancian magic. But WotC doesn’t have the balls to reinvent it. So they keep trying to cobble together some kind of half-assed fix to let spellcasters be less than useless when they run out of spells.

My two cents? Give sorcerers cantrips (possibly with a spellcasting check?) that they can use metamagic to improve as they advance in level, and make wizards do the resource management.

Then they’d actually be different.
 

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