D&D (2024) D&D 5.11 - the time of big change is over

[Remathilis]

Treantmonk just posted a video on YouTube about Jeremy saying things that were not WOW! popular will most likely be reverted to the 2014 versions (subclass cited as an example). I want to discuss the nature of what revisions we will likely expect.

(Note: this is NOT to discuss whether these changes constitute an edition. Enough of that. This is about what might still change and what won't.)

Let's begin at the beginning.

Species: I think that the 10 races in the PHB are locked. I don't necessarily think the exact traits will be the same as the playtests, but they are happy enough with what they got to finish up. I do wonder about if the legacy half-races make it in the PHB (or perhaps DMG)

Backgrounds and feats appear pretty locked in, though I think individual math might flux a bit in internal testing.

Epic boons are a lock, again subject to math fixing

I feel the bard is going to get a lot more options to snipe spells (rather than lists) and is going back to a spells known caster. I'm genuinely curious about what parts of the UA bard makes it now.

I think the ranger is going in more or less like the UA one, subject to bugfixes and with weapon mastery added.

The rogue is overwhelmingly going to look like the current rogue.

The cleric is going to return to domains getting proficiencies to keep compatibly.

The paladin loses ranged smite.

The druid is getting old wild shape back () With some changes in THP stacking and limits on what forms they can pick.

Looking ahead, I imagine pact magic will survive in some way for warlocks (though not like you think in the form of short rest recharge) and the arcane class specific spells (warlock pact, sorcerer uniques and wizard spell creation) will turn into some type of actual class feature (though a few might remain spells) and weapon mastery will make it in.

Anyone else want to play Diviner and guess what changes stay or revert?

Treantmonk's video:

 

[Parmandur]

Hard ti say before we see the next packet synthesizing their feedback on older options and hlthe initial proposals. Particularly hard to say about the Warrior a& Mages before we hear back about the latest survey. Could be the half-caster Warlock passed their "Wow!" threshold, we'll find out.

Species and Background stuff is pretty locked down, I think, which makes sense because it's working on the same math and the flavor in weeping Species away from racist tropes was handled well.

The only unambiguous success in the first 6 Classes (Experts & Priests) was the Ranger: the UA Ranger kicked the '14 Ranger's butt, so the next iteration will be more UA than '14. Clearly keeping Subclass adaptation easy and straightforward is a major design goal, enough that they are reverting to -14 Subclass progression ot make it easy. The few wrinkles between old and new Chasis are likely to be ironed out, so Bardic Inspirstion may be more like '14.

 

[OldSchoolGamerGirl]

Treantmonk just posted a video on YouTube about Jeremy saying things that were not WOW! popular will most likely be reverted to the 2014 versions (subclass cited as an example). I want to discuss the nature of what revisions we will likely expect.

(Note: this is NOT to discuss whether these changes constitute an edition. Enough of that. This is about what might still change and what won't.)

okay so I am going to list my thoughts OTHER then if it is a break point like an edition... (and FYI I do think that may not be true anymore)

Let's begin at the beginning.

Species: I think that the 10 races in the PHB are locked. I don't necessarily think the exact traits will be the same as the playtests, but they are happy enough with what they got to finish up. I do wonder about if the legacy half-races make it in the PHB (or perhaps DMG)

I am sad, I like new. However this may mean we keep half elf and half orc so I am happy about that.

Backgrounds and feats appear pretty locked in, though I think individual math might flux a bit in internal testing.

I don't mind the feats, but I REALLY want the features back and maybe brought up a bit.

Epic boons are a lock, again subject to math fixing

good.

I feel the bard is going to get a lot more options to snipe spells (rather than lists) and is going back to a spells known caster. I'm genuinely curious about what parts of the UA bard makes it now.

now I know you said this is how you feel, I hope bard gets it's own spell list.

I think the ranger is going in more or less like the UA one, subject to bugfixes and with weapon mastery added.

I am very interested in how that looks

The rogue is overwhelmingly going to look like the current rogue.

if it isn't broke don't fix it... I could see some tweeks, but this looks good

The cleric is going to return to domains getting proficiencies to keep compatibly.

I am interested to see how this turns out.

The paladin loses ranged smite.

boo booo

The druid is getting old wild shape back () With some changes in THP stacking and limits on what forms they can pick.

boo again I say boo.

Looking ahead, I imagine pact magic will survive in some way for warlocks

god I hope so Warlock is my favorite class and the most common one I have seen played, I am hopeful they keep it mostly as is.

Anyone else want to play Diviner and guess what changes stay or revert?

I wonder if we will get Aim built into the rogue like in Tasha's

 

[HammerMan]

I’m sad that we won’t get some of the changes as an optional car rent of the class but overall this is what I have been asking for (my second choice but still what I have asked for)

Anyone else want to play Diviner and guess what changes stay or revert?

I wonder if that means doing away with the 4 subclass per class and back to wizard and cleric getting them all.

I hope it means spells instead of class features are going away.

 

[mellored]

Other than the druid and warlock slots. I don't see much that went wrong in the playtest.

 

[jerryrice4949]

Unlike most people I hate the current Warlock and much prefer the UA version.

 

[Parmandur]

Other than the druid and warlock slots. I don't see much that went wrong in the playtest.

It's less about "going wrong" (and we don't know how the Warlock was received ywt), but recently Crawford stated that they aren6moving forward with changes that were received in a lukewarm fashion, only stuff that actively excited people. So a bunch of stuff that wasn't moving the needle is being phased out in favor of what was already in 'q4 rules, notably the different Subclass progressions for each Class.

 

[Parmandur]

Unlike most people I hate the current Warlock and much prefer the UA version.

Results haven't been commented upon yet, we donknow who represents "most people" yet. There's still a significant shot that will make it through.

 

[Retreater]

I wanted a new edition and exciting changes to make the game better.
Oh well. We don't have game designers in charge of D&D anymore.

 

[Lidgar]

I can imagine that WotC is having a heck of a time balancing survey feedback and their desire to drive sales. Even with their product diversification efforts, like VTT, generating hype around the need to "upgrade" to the latest "edition" has to be part of their strategy.

In other words, there needs to be enough upgrades to make buying the revised books (for the "same" edition of the game) worthwhile. I suspect they are working hard on the messaging for that campaign, as well as perhaps adding in options for some of the things we've seen in UA to sweeten the offering.