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D&D and the rising pandemic

Zardnaar

Legend
What are the assumptions/specifics going into the "are going to starve to death" number? Are you including the usual rate at which people starve in the world anyway, which is pretty high but not really related usually?

All the economic research I've seen on epidemic/pandemic circumstances suggests that longer and stricter restrictions on public gatherings, etcetera, produce dramatically better outcomes both in terms of lives lost and in terms of economic recovery. It turns out dead people don't come back to work.
Earlier in the thread articles were posted.

BBC had one saying the disruptions due to Covid at 30 million. Another poster said 100 million and posted the link.

Another article pointed out the problems of a one size fits all approach of lockdowns. In places like India people will starve.

It's a sad reality.
 
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Zardnaar

Legend
It's sad, but it's not universally true.
Some countries can't afford to lock down. India is one such place.

They're in some form of lockdown but people are gonna go hungary/starve.

Brazil and Venezuela as well.

Throw in economic disruption and the west is gonna be broke/short of food themselves.

There's food rotting in the ground in the UK atm because they don't have the migrants to harvest it, the British don't wanna do it and consumers don't want to pay more to pay the British to do it.

Everyone just kind of expects someone else to do it and they buy it for cheap.

Similar thing here and US. With lockdowns you either can't harvest it or if you can you can't sell it as the restaurants etc are shut.

Catch 22.
 



Lem23

Explorer
Nothing new. Look up luddites.
You should look up Luddites. Despite them now being associated with knee-jerk anti-technological groups, the original Luddites (Capital L, as followers of their possibly mythical hero Ned Ludd) were not anti-technology. They were a proto-union, workers who were being mistreated by shop owners, not being paid fairly, and undergoing unsafe practices that could maim or kill them. As a consequence, they first tried to reason with the owners, and wen that failed, went for direct action instead.

At the time, many factories encompassed large rooms where several owners would have their machines. The Luddites would often disguise themselves, then break into the factories and smash the equipment of those owners who were treating them unfairly. They would not smash the equipment of the fair employers. The Luddites stopped their attacks when unions were made legal in England.

If you're interested in learning more about the actual Luddites, start with EP Thompson's excellent The Making of the English Working Class which covers their history in some detail. He's also written some articles (as have others) that go into more detail on the Luddites and similar movements if you have access to journal databases.
 

Zardnaar

Legend
You should look up Luddites. Despite them now being associated with knee-jerk anti-technological groups, the original Luddites (Capital L, as followers of their possibly mythical hero Ned Ludd) were not anti-technology. They were a proto-union, workers who were being mistreated by shop owners, not being paid fairly, and undergoing unsafe practices that could maim or kill them. As a consequence, they first tried to reason with the owners, and wen that failed, went for direct action instead.

At the time, many factories encompassed large rooms where several owners would have their machines. The Luddites would often disguise themselves, then break into the factories and smash the equipment of those owners who were treating them unfairly. They would not smash the equipment of the fair employers. The Luddites stopped their attacks when unions were made legal in England.

If you're interested in learning more about the actual Luddites, start with EP Thompson's excellent The Making of the English Working Class which covers their history in some detail. He's also written some articles (as have others) that go into more detail on the Luddites and similar movements if you have access to journal databases.
Just as well it's a forum and I used it in it's anti technology context.

Since this isn't a university lecture il file it between I already know that/don't care.
 

Lem23

Explorer
Just as well it's a forum and I used it in it's anti technology context.

Since this isn't a university lecture il file it between I already know that/don't care.
Oh, don't worry, my university lecture on the subject goes on for about 45 minutes, though that does include a bit on the Captain Swing riots too. :D
 


Theo R Cwithin

I cast "Baconstorm!"
I know not a lot of people wore masks before covid, but I did see them here and there... and I don't recall all the righteous indignation against those people back then.
This is getting insane, and nasty.
 


Dannyalcatraz

Schmoderator
Staff member
I don’t wish evil on anyone, but the fact that Covid-19 is both dangerous but not OBVIOUSLY dangerous (as compared to diseases with much higher mortality rates) is proving to be a mixed blessing.

If it were moderately more lethal, the anti-mask/anti-vax bunch would either be much smaller and keeping a lower profile, or the issue would be self-correcting as the body count among their numbers would steadily rise.

As things are, only a fraction of those people acting out like that will directly or proximally experience a reality check, so the behavior is unlikely to disappear.

And that’s going to translate into a prolonged initial wave, a larger second wave, and more socioeconomic turmoil.
 

If Covid-19 was visible, people would avoid it like the plague that it is. Hypothetical situation:

Say, if everyone who was infected with Covid-19 temporarily became a zombie a couple weeks after being infected, everyone would do all that they could to avoid catching the virus. They'd wear masks, hazmat suits, avoid going out into public, not host Coronavirus parties, get vaccines if possible, not go to work, and so on. Even if it had the same fatality rate, people would have a much harsher response if the problem was visible.

Just a strange thought I had.
 

MarkB

Legend
If Covid-19 was visible, people would avoid it like the plague that it is. Hypothetical situation:

Say, if everyone who was infected with Covid-19 temporarily became a zombie a couple weeks after being infected, everyone would do all that they could to avoid catching the virus. They'd wear masks, hazmat suits, avoid going out into public, not host Coronavirus parties, get vaccines if possible, not go to work, and so on. Even if it had the same fatality rate, people would have a much harsher response if the problem was visible.

Just a strange thought I had.
Yeah, but they'd also try to shoot them in the head.
 

Zardnaar

Legend
Well waited until things got quiet after the initial rush.

For a post Covid world it seems bars and restaurants are quiet. Social distancing rules apply.

Under level two most things are open but shop early or be prepared to line up. They're limiting how many can go into stores at once.

Went to our equivalent of Walmart to get some clothes. Managed to snag a haircut. Social distancing was decent, they've marked out places you can line up etc.

Tourist places are screaming out for support/domestic tourists. Realistically a lot of those Business are doomed.

Public sympathy isn't very high it seems. They've been over charging tourists for years and priced a lot of locals out.

Resort town of Queenstown is projecting 30-50% unemployment. One deal I saw was 7 nights, ski field pass, rental car and meal voucher for $90 USD a day.

1 new case last few days. 2-3 total last week and a half. None locally for something like 35 days.

Not much in the way of mask wearing. Hand sanitizer is back on supermarket shelves, masks can be found if you know where to look. They're kind of expensive.

Haven't had the collapse USA has but unemployment is rising. Long term forecasts are bad for the next couple of years or three but better than say USA.

We're also having to deal with 100k migrant workers. Their visas are expiring, don't qualify for welfare and a lot of the jobs they were in have evaporated.

Little bit of fallout. Prime minister is super popular and with collapsing polls the opposition rolled their leader swapping a conservative right winger for a right of center type with more liberal social views. Hard right/left doesn't work so well in NZ. He botched the Covid response pulling the openup at all costs mentality a few weeks ago which evaporated around 1/3rd of their support. Goneburger.

Jacindas numbers officially make her the most popular Prime Minister ever at least while they gave done polling.
 


Eltab

Hero
69% of americans wear masks in public. The people who don't seem to be closer together, packed in groups, probably spreading the disease.
How do you (generic you) know who has it and who does not?
After two months of isolation, the asymptomatic contagious carriers of March should have given it to their families and either kicked it or seen hospitals by now.
 


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