D&D 5E D&D Beyond Self-Censorship: Pride Month Digital Dice Blocked In Some Countries

[Greg Benage]

Wouldn't Wizards need to put an "18+ warning" on the promotion to legally make it available in Turkey?

Turkey claims rainbows 'hurt children's mental health' in chilling clampdown on LGBT+ Pride merchandise

In Turkey, government advertising regulators have ruled LGBT+ and rainbow-themed products sold online must be advertised as 18+.

www.pinknews.co.uk

 

[Crimson Terrain]

Whatever the reality of the situation is. I'd say this is a rather unfortunate decision as it undermines the supposed intent behind making something of this nature available in the first place. I get the legal and business reasons for doing such a thing, but it still stands at least to me that if you're going to only represent an issue where it is convenient to do so, then you are not really supporting it in the way such gestures are meant to. Would it be better not to do this at all if you aren't going to make it available everywhere...maybe, but arguments could surely be made to the opposite. I don't honestly know the absolute answer to this. However, at least speaking for myself, I would not engage in attempting to represent a group or issue if I were not willing to represent it everywhere regardless of any consequence, social, legal, or otherwise.

 

[Ondath]

Wouldn't Wizards need to put an "18+ warning" on the promotion to legally make it available in Turkey?

Turkey claims rainbows 'hurt children's mental health' in chilling clampdown on LGBT+ Pride merchandise

In Turkey, government advertising regulators have ruled LGBT+ and rainbow-themed products sold online must be advertised as 18+.

www.pinknews.co.uk

I explained above that there is no legal basis for the ministry's decision, and many companies like Amazon sell pride-themed goods with no +18 disclaimer.

 

[Greg Benage]

I explained above that there is no legal basis for the ministry's decision, and many companies like Amazon sell pride-themed goods with no +18 disclaimer.

Ah, I guess the article is inaccurate. My apologies.

Rather, it instructs that selling the merchandise without a warning “constitutes a violation of the legal regulations”, read the letter, signed by Oğuz Şahin, a deputy general manager at the Ministry of Commerce.

He noted that companies that do not rate rainbow goods as 18+ will see advertisements suspended.

The twin backbone of the new rule will be a pair of clauses in Article 24 of Turkey’s 2015 Regulation on Commercial Advertisement and Unfair Commercial Practices, the letter said.

 

[Ondath]

Ah, I guess the article is inaccurate. My apologies.

The ministry did make that threat, yes, but it isn't universally applied. Also, if the only sanction they have on their hands is suspending advertisement, that means nothing for D&D Beyond since their website doesn't have any advertisements anyway.

 

[Greg Benage]

The ministry did make that threat, yes, but it isn't universally applied. Also, if the only sanction they have on their hands is suspending advertisement, that means nothing for D&D Beyond since their website doesn't have any advertisements anyway.

Yeah, I have no idea how the rule might be interpreted, applied or enforced, and I suspect Wizards doesn't either. I expect they take guidance from the governments of the countries where they operate and set a policy that isn't revised until new guidance is forthcoming. I'd be extraordinarily surprised if there is someone in their legal department looking at each Pride promotion they might want to do and evaluating its legality in individual markets.

In any case, thanks for shining some light on it.

 

[Malmuria]

Both you and Ondath have focused on Istanbul in your descriptions. Can you also give us an idea of what the LGBT community might be like (or what they experience) in geographically different places like in Antalya, Sivas, or Van? I picked these cities randomly off a map, so feel free to replace them with other examples.

My goal here is to get a better understanding of the country as a whole. I'm a little concerned about falling into the trap where people think all of the US is New York City.

I think it’s roughly similar to the United States in that less urban areas are perhaps more conservative. And I think the threat on that level is more from hostile individuals than the government. The state will shut down a public pride parade, for example, but is not likely to come to your house because they see you’ve been rolling rainbow colored dice. I mean, @Ondath is, as we speak, posting about these dice on twitter and here, which is much more visible than just using them on dnd beyond.

Another way to say that, is if these pride dice are available in wyoming, I don’t see why they shouldn’t be available in Turkey.

 

[LordEntrails]

However, if they do choose to support a social cause, and to attempt to reap publicity/PR benefit from supporting that cause, then they do become ethically obligated to be transparent about their support for that cause, and any bounds on it, and they need to actually support it. Something which WotC are currently failing extremely hard at. "No taxation without representation". Except here it's "No claiming you support social causes without actually doing it".

Agreed. Though I would suggest one consider that transparency is not all or nothing, it has degrees of opaqueness. I disagree that WotC is failing extremely ard, but again it is a matter of degree. And as others have said, given WotC's track record on the issue, i think they have earned some leeway and some time to develop a response. Pus we should realize "they" might not even be aware of the impact of their current policy and the concern that it be reconsidered.

n case you're just being absolutely clumsy and terrible at arguing, or profoundly misunderstood/confused me with someone else,

Have you noticed that this seems to be a typical response from you to arguments you don't agree with? Perhaps we should all try and mae a it more effort to understand the point the other is trying to make or view to discuss rather than attacking the means in which it is done.

But it's pretty bad to claim to support something but not actually to make any effort.

In this case, WotC is making an effort. Maybe they have made mistakes or errors in execution of that support, but they clearly have made an effort to support LBGTQ+ causes.

 

[LordEntrails]

Another way to say that, is if these pride dice are available in wyoming, I don’t see why they shouldn’t be available in Turkey.

Well two reasons I can think of. One, different laws and judicial systems. And Two, in Wyoming WotC clearly understands their legal rights and social risks; while in Turkey they probably don't.

 

[Yaarel]

It is. And its still something I find strange. In general I don't think companies should be obligated to engage in social issues. And when they chose to do so, should they not be allowed to do so as they wish? And of course, if we don't like how a company choses to do that, then we as individuals get to decide how we interact with them.

But just as I believe that I have no right to insist on how another human choses to interact on a social issue (as long as they are not doing so illegally and/or immorally), I don't see an individual's right to demand such of a corporation. BUT, I do hope that people and corporations CAN engage in discussions on the ways in which they chose to get involved (or not) in social issues.

So, by all means, try to engage WotC in discussing their decision if they are willing. But if they chose not to engage in such a discussion, take it for what it is and move on.

It seems to me,

Today, corporations are more powerful than democratically elected governments. Indeed, cooperation between the corporate plutocracy often determines, by means of financial support, who can and cannot win an election.

With power comes responsibility. Especially ethical responsibilities.

Dont let the perfect become an enemy of the good. But it is reasonable to hold corporate cultures accountable for ethical policies.