D&D 5E D&D Promises to Make the Game More Queer

[Sir Brennen]

"Are asking for media content creators to either let their work speak for themselves" is a good idea. And while nothing can be truly apolitical, I would argue to say that there is a vast difference between D&D and The Jungle. D&D is a game you play to escape from the real world. You would only read a book like The Jungle if you were interested in the ideas is presents. Personally, I want as little overlap between real world politics in my free time as possible.

As I've said before:

Keep the gay characters.

Get rid of the intention to change society through a game.

If you want to change society, you can grab your facts, I'l grab mine, we can both analyze them and present our views, then we both walk home knowing a little bit more about both sides of the issue.

1) Where did Crawford say he was trying to change society in that article? He just said they made a decision to include LGBT characters. All that does is improve the game for their players who appreciate the inclusiveness. (EDIT: And if you dont' appreciate inclusiveness, you're probably not someone I'd want to game with.)

2) As has been stated, facts alone don't change society (otherwise we'd still be in the Paris Accords). Experience and exposure usually need to be added to the mix to affect change, as when conservative politicians alter their public anti-LBGT stances when they have an LBGT child of their own.

 

[tombowings]

So creators should not consider anything that may be considered thought provoking or controversial or edgy in what they do? They should not use metaphor or allegory or include any social commentary in any way?

Or is this restriction limited to RPGs for some reason? If so, why? What makes an RPG such a poor vehicle for conveying thoughts as compared to a novel or a movie, or any other medium?

Because an RPG is a group activity in which many people come together to enjoy. Many friends use weekly D&D games to socialize. Those groups are dependent on all members retaining interest in the game. If WotC suddenly starts to target a specific ideology, many groups could torn apart as a result. Or in my case, I could literally end up drowned in a river for continuing to play the "gay game" in the country I life in. There's that, too.

 

[MechaPilot]

All I'm saying is that the a children's game is not the right place for that battle to play out.

That's why you won't find it in Candy Land or Chutes & Ladders. D&D is not a children's game. If it is a children's game, then your self-professed inclusion of rape in the game is a FAR more serious thing for children to be exposed to than the relationship of two consenting adults who happen to be of the same sex.

 

[Morrus]

I do not feel the need for my fantasy to be a vehicle of promoting causes. If I did, I would take up collections at every gaming session to feed hungry children or to help with my local animal rescue.

The bit you’re blind to is this:

You have not posted in a thread decrying the existence of hungry children or abused animals in your adventures.

You have posted in a thread decrying the existence of gay people in your adventures.

To you, one is different to the other. You didn’t claim there was hungry children agenda when Curse of Strahd had some hungry children in it.

 

[Prakriti]

EN World is not a suitable medium for your propaganda.

Jeremy Crawford takes a public, avowed stance to push a social cause in D&D, and the people taking issue with it are the propagandists?

Morrus, are you feeling okay?

 

[Sir Brennen]

This is not how change has ever happened, and it is unlikely how change will ever happen, especially when it is a debate about the relative humanity and rights of a group of people. Did you read The Oatmeal comic on The Backfire Effect? You should really read The Oatmeal comic on The Backfire Effect.

http://theoatmeal.com/comics/believe

Bad link, sir. (extra "http://" at the end).

 

[Irda Ranger]

D&D is a game you play to escape from the real world.

I both agree with this and can't help but point out how hopelessly subjective it is. For some people, "escaping the real world" means escaping to a world where their gender/religion/race/sexuality/whatever isn't a constant problem for them.

Personally, I want as little overlap between real world politics in my free time as possible.

Did you see my question about quantifying when something stops being political? What level of social acceptance of homosexual unions would be necessary before you'd be OK with it?

 

[MechaPilot]

Because an RPG is a group activity in which many people come together to enjoy. Many friends use weekly D&D games to socialize. Those groups are dependent on all members retaining interest in the game. If WotC suddenly starts to target a specific ideology, many groups could torn apart as a result. Or in my case, I could literally end up drowned in a river for continuing to play the "gay game" in the country I life in. There's that, too.

People have also faced the threat of being murdered for voting. If they had all let that stop them from voting, their voices would have gone unheard and it's likely that nothing would have changed for the better for them.

 

[Gradine]

As I said, we have a long way to come as a species with regards to reason, logic, and understanding. I will, however, not advocate for the use of the wrong tools for the right reasons.

You have not adequately demonstrated how media is the "wrong tool" for social change, and have not responded to all evidence to the contrary, which I'll refer to as "The History of Media As a Tool To Promote Ideology And Social Change, Also Simply Known as the History of Media"

The biggest problem is you're not asserting that "media is the wrong tool" because you are, like MLK Jr's "white moderate", overly concerned with protecting a "false peace'. It appears to be coming from a place of intellectual snobbery. Which I shouldn't have to explain is a morally and ethically indefensible position to take and much worse even than the kind of feigned paternalism MLK was railing against in his Letter from the Birmingham Jail.

 

[Gradine]

Bad link, sir. (extra "http://" at the end).

Thanks for the catch, I've fixed the link.