D&D "Super Heroes"

RangerWickett said:
I'm sorry. What spell does a wizard have to stop Superman in a single hit? Because, even though comic writers never take advantage of this, Superman is so ridiculously stupidly uninterestingly powerful that if he knows someone is trying to hurt him, he should just win.

Any of them that are save or die. It is actually one of his listed vulnerabilities - if I were running it myself he'd have enough negatives to the save to bring him down into the 'normal human' range - which is how it's treated in DC. He's 'normal' when it comes to a magical effect, no armor, strength, etc.

The only thing the wizard would have to do is have a surprise round. Zadara could take him out in a heartbeat, ditto the Darkness (being a magical creature) if Jackie weren't just playing around.
 

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Quickened Cloudkill + Forcecage and Supes is dead dead dead. He will always pass that fort save of course, but even 1 point of con adds up if you wait long enough.

The thing to remember is realistically, the only true superheroes at high levels are wizards and other spellcasters. A 20th level fighter is pretty awesome, but strip him of all his magic and he's not THAT much more impressive than a 10th level fighter.

Spellcasters though are often better than superheroes, I think even Dr. Fate would blush at some of the things a 20th level wizard or cleric can pull off:)
 

Stalker0 said:
Quickened Cloudkill + Forcecage
Cloudkill doesn't allow SR which means the gas itself is non-magical. Supes wouldn't be harmed. The spell description specifies that creatures immune to poison are unaffected.
 

Stalker0 said:
Quickened Cloudkill + Forcecage and Supes is dead dead dead. He will always pass that fort save of course, but even 1 point of con adds up if you wait long enough.

The thing to remember is realistically, the only true superheroes at high levels are wizards and other spellcasters. A 20th level fighter is pretty awesome, but strip him of all his magic and he's not THAT much more impressive than a 10th level fighter.

Spellcasters though are often better than superheroes, I think even Dr. Fate would blush at some of the things a 20th level wizard or cleric can pull off:)


Bwuhhh?
Dr. Fate pretty much has Wish as a quickened SU ability usable at will.
Superman's initiative bonus would be in the low 1000's, with approximately equal bonuses to spot and listen.
Nobody could take him down with something as simple as a surprise round or quickened spell.
 

Stalker0 said:
Quickened Cloudkill + Forcecage and Supes is dead dead dead. He will always pass that fort save of course, but even 1 point of con adds up if you wait long enough.

Just a pet peeve, but this is right there next to "Timestop + delayed blast fireball" in that people tote it as a kill anything example, but it doesn't really work.

"Unlike a fog cloud, the cloudkill moves away from you at 10 feet per round, rolling along the surface of the ground. Figure out the cloud’s new spread each round based on its new point of origin, which is 10 feet farther away from the point of origin where you cast the spell."

So someone in a force cage is only in the cloudkill for 2 rounds. Sorry, not lethal.
 

Superman? A 20th-level wizard would clean his clock. Even if Superman made every saving throw roll, a high-level wizard has so many options at his command, he can easily catch Supes in a no-save spell. A single 20th-level wizard has more options, and more powerful options than the entire Justice League combined. And that's before even considering magic equipment.

Superman is vulnerable to Magic (one reason Shazam can clean his clock).

However, keep in mind that his Str, Dex, and Con are all probably in the low 60s. And his Fly speed is... well, faster than a speeding bullet.

Superman's vulnerability to magic notwithstanding, superheroes in his power category are more akin to demigods & lesser gods than even Epic level PCs. Technically, some of them are even actualy greater gods- Thor, perhaps?

As for the assertion about Supes...seeing as how he can actually attack people from beond the atmosphere (say, by dropping a 150+ ton rock on them), move faster than the eye can see (How many swift actions would he get? How many miles would his half-move be?), use his heat vision to cook them as long as he has LOS...despite his vulnerability to magic, a wizard needs to trick Kal-el into range without arousing his suspicions before he could take him down.

That said, because he is vulnerable to magic, if he does get surprised, it could be a short fight.
Well, that's not true. High-level D&D characters are more powerful than even comic book super heroes.

Again, that would depend upon the D&D PC and superhero involved in the discussion.

For instance, I can't think of a single D&D PC (even epic ones) who could take down

...the Flash (or Makkari). They simply don't have the reflexes to deal with any being who (in almost every incarnation) can move in reasonable percentages of c or faster. What is a wizard going to do against someone who has landed 150 punches or more in the time it takes him to start the syllable that will cast a quickened spell...

...Or Green Lantern whose only limitations are the color yellow and the strength of his will.

...The Hulk whose strength has no upper limit...essentially infinitely stacking rage that boosts every second.

...Hyperion, Titan, Supreme, Thor, Ultra Boy, Mon-El or any of the other Superman/Shazam type characters that have appeared in comics over the ages...

...without exploiting a known weakness.
 

It could be an interesting epic quest, though. A creature based on a comic book super-villian, such as Loki or Dark Seid comes to the campaign world and quickly begins to take over. The player characters have to go on a quest to find out the weaknesses of this villian and take him out since their normal combative abilities matter not.
 

Destil said:
Just a pet peeve, but this is right there next to "Timestop + delayed blast fireball" in that people tote it as a kill anything example, but it doesn't really work.

"Unlike a fog cloud, the cloudkill moves away from you at 10 feet per round, rolling along the surface of the ground. Figure out the cloud’s new spread each round based on its new point of origin, which is 10 feet farther away from the point of origin where you cast the spell."

So someone in a force cage is only in the cloudkill for 2 rounds. Sorry, not lethal.

Forcecage has the option of "solid walls", cloudkill doesn't move through [Force] effects... does it?
 



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