D&D - Thinking outside of the box

[Dr Simon]

Whilst it's good that there is a baseline assumption about what you can expect in D&D, I've seen examples where these assumptions become not about what you might find in a D&D game, but about what you might find in fantasy in general.

Two examples:

Recently on Usenet a poster uploaded his race "Elflings" for critique concerning balance. They were, basically, a half-breed of elf and halfling. People honestly replied that "Elves don't interbreed with halflings" as if this was an established fact across all settings! Personally I thought it a bit of a redundant idea, but if you want a setting where elves and halflings are interfertile, go for it!

Long ago when we were first setting up the Conclave, I suggested that we try not to use the 'standard' races of elves, dwarves, etc. which some people felt quite strongly that 'it wouldn't be fantasy without them'. Tell that to Leiber, Howard, Eddings, Zelazny, Jordan, LeGuin, Donaldson, Moorcock and all those other losers! I've nothing against elves, dwarves etc. but the point was to create a collaborative, original webworld and there are already plenty of other projects out there with elves, dwarves etc.. Fargoth does the job admirably - why do the same thing?

(Currently the intellectual exercise is trying to fit Conclave into the core D&D rules, which isn't too hard, thus supporting Jurgen's point that the system is a framework, and looser than you might think).

 

[Thanee]

I pondered for a moment, then said, "Sure."

This will be a fun campaign.

< enter clever frankenstein reference here >

Bye
Thanee

 

[jdrakeh]

I'm with Jurgen on this. It's one thing to know D&D's core asumptions, and a far better thing to know how and when to break them.

Agreed. When I read Jurgen's post, the first thing that came to mind was that completely insane "if it's not an analogue for medieval Europe, then it's not fantasy" thread -- sadly, that kind of uninformed, narrow-mindedness, is far more widespread than it should be in a hobby ostensibly devoted to realizing imaginary worlds

 

[KenSeg]

Going outside of the box is great for finding something on which to hang quests and such. Our personal character generator provides for good and bad characteristics. Several characters have had demon spawn for a good characteristic, providing the DM with a great story line of the character trying to find a way to expunge the taint of evil from their soul caused by this background. Just imagine how much more dramatic it would be for a character aspiring to become a paladin?

-KenSeg
gaming since 1978

 

[Umbran]

...sadly, that kind of uninformed, narrow-mindedness, is far more widespread than it should be in a hobby ostensibly devoted to realizing imaginary worlds

Well, let's not be narrowminded ourselves - for some (perhaps many) the hobby may not be about "realizing" anything. Maybe it is about killing things and taking their stuff. Maybe it is about game tactics. Maybe it is about.... well, just about anything a gamer might find fun.

For some of those other modes and reasons for play, maybe the consistency is more important than the breadth of possibility.

 

[green slime]

I agree with Umbran on this one.

 

[buzz]

I agree with Umbran on this one.

Ditto.

For a lot of people, gaming isn't about creating something unique; it's about emulating and exploring something they enjoy. I mean, that was the whole impetus for D&D's creation in the first place. "Gary, it'd be cool if we could use these minis rules to play a bunch of hobbits and wizards fighting goblins in Moria."

Also, fans of D&D are often fans of D&D, not fantasy in general, the same way that some people like SF if it means Star Wars and not if it means Traveller. They specifically want the tropes in place.

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

Vast is Umbran's wisdom.

 

[Mystery Man]

Everyone has a point of view and a certain way they like doing things. Perfectly fine with me, my ego is not so huge that I think everyone should agree with me. That and the original intent of the thread was to discuss (hence the reason for "discuss" being the only thing in the thread), not "see things my way". That fact that some people disagreed, or thought it was a bad idea is ok. However I enjoyed the more thoughtful answers, and I think that is the point Jurgen is trying to make.

 

[Elk_Weaver]

Common Sense

As a GM, I would rather have a player who enriches a character with his actions during the game. to many times do you see someone who is to focused on game mechanics that lose sight of how there character should develop. For example if the Paladin inadvertantly saved the succubus in some way and she felt tied to him then it seems perfectly plausible for that succubus to become part of the paladin. But if a character leveled up and PRESTO! he has a succubus written on his character sheet... than as a GM I would have issues with that. In a thought out world things that happen have consequences. The faith of the paladin... What kind of issues would that create would he be exiled and then would he have to prove the succubus not evil. blah blah blah. You get the point. I guess what I am saying is that critical things like that need to happen with certain criteria to guide it.