D&D Wargaming *ARMIES OF GOOD*

[Tyreus]

No problem, I thought your little story was amusing . Now with the changes it looks more like a second level character. Fieari- How many CR points do I get?

EDIT: Oh, and the HD cost +0.45 because they're intellegent constructs, if they were mindless it would be +0.35.

 

[Carnifex]

Here's what I've come up with. I have made the suggested changes.

War Machine (4 pts each)
Medium Construct
Hit Dice: 3d10 (41 hp)
Initiative: +0 (+0 Dex)
Speed: 30 feet, fly 120 ft clumsy
Armor Class: 22 (+0 Dex, +8 natural armor, +4 armor)
Base Attack/Grapple: +2/+6
Space/Reach: 5 ft./5 ft.
Attacks: +6 greatsword, 2d6+6
Special Attacks:
Special Qualities: Construct traits, damage reduction 5/adamantine, fast healing 3, greater teleport 2/day, Blindsense
Saves: Fort +1, Ref +1, Will +1
Abilities: Str 18, Dex 10, Con -, Int 10, Wis 10, Cha 10
Skills: Craft(weapons) +6, Craft(armor) +2
CR 2

type +2.4
natural armor +0.8
abilities +0.8
flight, clumsy, 120 ft +0.4
fast healing 3 +0.225
3 HD +1.35
greater teleport 2/day +0.182
damage reduction +0.25
blind sense +0.2
6.607

Looking much better. After Golden and Silver Rule, this new version comes out at CR 4 (well, 3.955475 to be precise) so you're looking at 16 points each. Still not the CR 2 you're looking for, I'm afraid, but this version is far more reasonable.


Fieari, if you read this, can I ask - are the bad guys also being 'reasonable' if they're building new units? 'cos if they're munching out the CR construction system themselves then I recommend we do the same and to hell with fairness, but I'd like to think both sides come up with some inventive but fair new units...

 

[Tyreus]

Base: 6.607
Golden: 6.607-X= 3.907 (X=HDx2, 2.7) 3.907/2 +1.35= 3.3035
Silver: 3.3035 x .85= 2.807975
Rounded down: 2

This is where I got 2. Am I doing something wrong?

 

[Carnifex]

Base: 6.607
Golden: 6.607-X= 3.907 (X=HDx2, 2.7) 3.907/2 +1.35= 3.3035
Silver: 3.3035 x .85= 2.807975
Rounded down: 2

This is where I got 2. Am I doing something wrong?

Yep.

For the Golden Rule, you basically minus 2 x the HD cost (2.7) from the main cost, then halve what is left. Then add 2.7 back again. 6.607 - 2.7 is 3.907. This halved gives us 1.9535. 1.9535 + the unmodified CR chunk, the 2.7, gives us 4.6535, which we then Silver Rule by multiplying by .85 to end up with 3.955475, which we round up to 4. Indeed, I'd round up your 2.8 calculation up to 3 rather than 2, but I think you've gone wrong somewhere in your Golden Rule calculations to end up with 3.3 in the first place. Oh, I see what you've done. You minused the 2.7, but then failed to add it back in - you only added the HD cost of 1.35 back, not adding the untouched special abilities of 1.35 as well. This line:

Golden: 6.607-X= 3.907 (X=HDx2, 2.7) 3.907/2 +1.35= 3.3035

...should read...

Golden: 6.607-X= 3.907 (X=HDx2, 2.7) 3.907/2 +2.7= 4.6535

There, that should help.

 

[Tyreus]

Oh, I see. But why are you rounding up? I was told to round down.

Fourth column is "Silver Rule, Rounded Down"... first apply the golden rule, described at the top, then multiply by 0.85 to account for the fact that PC classes are on average, 15% better than all monsters, and then round down.

 

[Carnifex]

Oh, I see. But why are you rounding up? I was told to round down.

Well, because 3.955 is just so close to being 4 that it seems rather silly to then round it down. Actually, if you look at Table 1-1 after the Golden Rule, it also adds something else, fractional CR's to CR's below four, although he doesn't specify whether you should round to the nearest or always round down there. If we go with the Silver Rule strictly, then for your original 2.8 calculation it would round to 2 1/2, and for the correct 3.955 calc it would round down to 3 1/3, though I still feel slightly uneasy about being able to create a monster that could be 0.005 away from being 4 and then rounding it down rather than up.

 

[Tyreus]

Tsk, tsk. You need to practice being a munchkin... Are there any suggestions you have in making this a CR 2? I'll play around with it some more.

 

[Carnifex]

Tsk, tsk. You need to practice being a munchkin... Are there any suggestions you have in making this a CR 2? I'll play around with it some more.

Well, I think the thing is that you're gonna have to give up some of your ideas to achieve CR 2, simply because theyr'e just costing too much. I'd say drop the HD to 2, and also the fast healing to 2 as well. Drop a coupla points of natural armour. Drop either the flight *or* the greater teleport, because to be honest I don't think you really need both - or drop the flight speed down by at least half, since that'll save some points. Then tot up the CR once more and see how it's going

Edit: And possibly also drop Blindsense to squeeze down the CR that little bit lower, though it is a useful ability.

 

[Wrahn]

Tsk, tsk. You need to practice being a munchkin...

We prefer the name Powergamer, thank you very much

 

[Tyreus]

Hey, no worries, I'm a munch <caugh> ... er, powergamer too.

I think I've fixed it. Now, hopefully some of my soldiers will agree with the process....