Darksun TSR sales! From Benjamin Riggs.

[Reynard]

I would not find it odd to see them as something you can buy from an expanded equipment list in a 5e spelljammer setting book where they are in a bunch of the art.

Sure, but their presence in the DMG doesn't actually say anything about how "sci-fi" this iteration of Spelljammer is going to be, which was my main question.

 

[Jer]

Sure, but their presence in the DMG doesn't actually say anything about how "sci-fi" this iteration of Spelljammer is going to be, which was my main question.

Out of curiousity - if the laser guns are magic laser guns instead of science laser guns does that change things? As in is it the trappings of sci-fi that are important or the grounding in actual science?

Because I'm pretty sure they're using guns powered by magic - or at most by some kind of Handwavium indistinguishable from magic - and not by atomic batteries or something like that.

 

[Reynard]

Out of curiousity - if the laser guns are magic laser guns instead of science laser guns does that change things? As in is it the trappings of sci-fi that are important or the grounding in actual science?

Because I'm pretty sure they're using guns powered by magic - or at most by some kind of Handwavium indistinguishable from magic - and not by atomic batteries or something like that.

It does for me. If they are "magic laser guns" then we aren't talking about it being in the same genre as Starfinder (which was what prompted this line of discussion). There's nothing wrong with magic laser guns and I think they are pretty cool, but that is different than a setting that mixes high tech and the fantastic.

 

[Stormonu]

The original Spelljammer had Giff with their wheellocks and bombards. But not any sci-fi weaponry that I recall.

I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to magitek weapons in SJ, but I think this might just be one group's take. The recently released adventure doesn't have sci-fi pistols - though it does have a Star Trek-like holodeck.

 

[Voadam]

Sure, but their presence in the DMG doesn't actually say anything about how "sci-fi" this iteration of Spelljammer is going to be, which was my main question.

I think the existence of existing mechanics for laser guns means it is easier and therefore slightly more likely to be incorporated as a part of the setting than if there were none and they had to come up with new mechanics.

The original 2e Spelljammer incorporated the smoke powder and starwheel pistols and such that were introduced in the 2e Forgotten Realms Adventures and made it a big part of the Giff culture and a minor part of Spelljammer.

The art is the big predictor though for the direction of 5e Spelljammer.

 

[jolt]

As the 80's were coming to a close, you started seeing a lot of metaplot driven games (Shadowrun, TORG, etc.). It was a big "thing" going on at the time. FR was the setting that was doing that. Gary was already gone and, while Greyhawk was still around, it had been heavily marginalized. When they tried introducing metaplot into Greyhawk, it really didn't work. Most of the people who wanted metaplot had already switched to FR years before; there was no benefit to switching back to a setting that had been largely ignored for years at that point just because metaplot had been introduced to it. The Greyhawk fans weren't particularly happy either though. Many of them never wanted metaplot in the first place.

It also felt very weird to have TSR, who by that point had spent years showing nothing but disdain and scorn for all things Gygax, were now releasing a Greyhawk City boxed set. City, Wars, and After the Ashes were all slick looking products, but the writing and characterizations were atrocious. It's no surprise that AtA tanked. The FR fans largely ignored Greyhawk and the Greyhawk fans had already been colossally let down years before. Who was left to buy it?

 

[QuentinGeorge]

As the 80's were coming to a close, you started seeing a lot of metaplot driven games (Shadowrun, TORG, etc.). It was a big "thing" going on at the time. FR was the setting that was doing that. Gary was already gone and, while Greyhawk was still around, it had been heavily marginalized. When they tried introducing metaplot into Greyhawk, it really didn't work. Most of the people who wanted metaplot had already switched to FR years before; there was no benefit to switching back to a setting that had been largely ignored for years at that point just because metaplot had been introduced to it. The Greyhawk fans weren't particularly happy either though. Many of them never wanted metaplot in the first place.

It also felt very weird to have TSR, who by that point had spent years showing nothing but disdain and scorn for all things Gygax, were now releasing a Greyhawk City boxed set. City, Wars, and After the Ashes were all slick looking products, but the writing and characterizations were atrocious. It's no surprise that AtA tanked. The FR fans largely ignored Greyhawk and the Greyhawk fans had already been colossally let down years before. Who was left to buy it?

Let me reiterate it was nothing to do with the writing quality.

 

[darjr]

Just you wait! Dark Sun is the only TSR setting for which I have ALL ThE NUMBERS! Every adventure! Every novel! The whole burrito!

 

[Dungeonosophy]

“For those of you keeping score at home, Greyhawk, Dragonlance, and Forgotten Realms are the only settings to sell more than 200,000 copies over their lifetimes.”

And Mystara. Which outsold them all.

 

[QuentinGeorge]

“For those of you keeping score at home, Greyhawk, Dragonlance, and Forgotten Realms are the only settings to sell more than 200,000 copies over their lifetimes.”

And Mystara. Which outsold them all.

And it’s entirely due to them being released in the 1st edition era rather than 2nd.